Panel shuts down as soon as heating elements turned on

themoose · Joined: 10 May 2017 Posts: 16 Location: 60069

Hello Kal,

We have a two 50A panel set up for our nano brewery that allows us to brew back to back brews. Both panels were ordered through your site and built by your contractor. We love them!

We've had a new issue with the panel that heats our BK that just started after about 200 brew days. It started at first as very occasional, but has progressed.

At first, every once in a while, we would check on the boil to see that the panel had turned itself off during the boil. We would reset the panel and it would work just fine once restarted. Now it has progressed to the point where it is turning off constantly, sometimes as soon as we attempt to turn the heating elements on. Also, sometimes when we attempt to reset panel and turn it back on, it does not turn on. I thought at first that maybe it was overheating and a safety was turning it off, but now it is shutting off before it could possibly overheat, so I don't think that is the issue. I've opened up the panel and everything looks brand new in there (no scorching, or melting) and no breakers are tripping in the panel or on our brewery's panel.

We have tried swapping out the power cords to the panel, and the temp probe lines. Also, when it is running, we are not seeing any abnormalities with amps or anything. No power spikes or losses.

Any chance you might know what could be causing this and what we need to do to fix it? We are at a loss! Thanks, in advance, for any advice you might have.

**kal** · Posted: Mon Jun 15, 2020 10:34 pm Post subject:

Hi Chris,

Can you email us at sales@TheElectricBrewery.com so that we can look up both of your orders to get a better idea what we're dealing with? Thanks! Through the forum we unforunately don't know who you are so we have no record of past conversations or what items were ordered. Likely to be something simple/inexpensive to fix.

Cheers!

Kal

**kal** · Posted: Wed Jun 17, 2020 1:23 pm Post subject:

Just to close the loop in case anyone else is reading this in the future (as I hate when you search for something, find someone with the same issue as you, but there's no follow-up!) Wink

Chris has one of our 30+ gallons panels that we built in 2011 that will intermittently shut down on it's own (no pattern, doesn't have anything to do with heating elements coming on). The list of internal parts that could cause the panel to just turn off is one of the following:

- The single NO contactor on the POWER KEY switch: https://shop.theelectricbrewery.com/collections/switches/products/normally-open-no-contactor-10a-240vac
- The SAFE START RELAY: https://shop.theelectricbrewery.com/collections/ssrs-relays-contactors/products/10a-8-pin-2-pole-ice-cube-plug-in-relay-120v-ac-coil
- The POWER IN CONTACTOR: DIN rail version is https://shop.theelectricbrewery.com/collections/din-rail-components/products/63a-250v-dpst-contactor-110-120v-ac-coil-din-rail, non-DIN rail version is https://shop.theelectricbrewery.com/pages/2-pole-50a-resistive-240vac-contactor-with-110-120vac-coil

There are other contactors (ELEMENT SELECT switch, PUMP switches) but they only stop the panel from being able to be turned on if any of the pumps or elements may be on. Once on, the contactors are bypassed automatically as power is latched by the SAFE START RELAY.

So it should be one of those 3 parts that will cause the panel to turn off if it’s turning off erratically. Wiring diagram here that shows the 3 parts: http://www.theelectricbrewery.com/images/interlock50A1BBL.jpg

Intermittent issues are the hardest to pinpoint. If you get a case where the panel can't be turned back on (and you're sure the PUMP and ELEMENT SELECT or ELEMENT ON/OFF switches are in the OFF position) try testing / replacing these 3 parts. In this case I suspect the POWER KEY switch NO contactor so a replacement will be tried. All the parts are inexpensive and easy to replace. All it takes is a screwdriver to replace.

We support our products and customers for life.

Cheers!

Kal

themoose · Joined: 10 May 2017 Posts: 16 Location: 60069

Hello Everyone,

Wanted to get back to this post and update everyone just in case they have this issue at one point. We replaced the NO contactor on the POWER KEY switch and the problem has not reoccurred. It took me 2 minutes to swap the part out.

Thank you, Kal, for your great customer service. Kal sent me multiple emails without delay and even did some trouble shooting on his own end to narrow down the issue. That level of customer care is unusual these days and it doesn't go unnoticed!

Cheers everyone! Mug

**kal** · Posted: Tue Jul 07, 2020 3:53 pm Post subject:

Glad to help and glad to hear it was an easy fix Chris!

The panel's purposely designed to be quick and easy to service.

Kal

themoose · Joined: 10 May 2017 Posts: 16 Location: 60069

Hi Kal,

I hate to report that we are having issues with that control panel again. Since my last post, it has only worked intermittently and due to how busy we were, I let it sit for quite a while because we didn't have time to work on it. I have replaced all three parts you recommended replacing. As a side note, we also had an electrician come out and he found the original contractor had run 8 gauge wire to the panel and the wire had overheated and some of the insulation had melted. We replaced it with 6 gauge wire now.

What is happening now is that we can turn the panel on and it will still on as long as we want it to as long as we do not turn heating elements on. If we turn either the BK or HLT elements on, it will stay on for about 10-15 minutes and then the entire panel shuts down. As long as I reset the panel, I can turn it right back on. So, it seems that something that leads to the elements is tripping. Any new advise?

**kal** · Posted: Wed Sep 29, 2021 3:29 pm Post subject:

themoose · Joined: 10 May 2017 Posts: 16 Location: 60069

When I say reset, I mean just turning panel off, turning all the pump switches or element switches off, and then turning it back on again. There is no obvious tripping of anything, either in the panel itself, or at the brewery's electrical panel.

**kal** · Posted: Wed Sep 29, 2021 4:04 pm Post subject:

Thanks for confirming Chris. The 3 parts you've replaced are the most obvious as they are the mechanical parts that would be the first to make intermittent contact / require replacing. Rare, but you never know. All of them need to stay in a closed state for the panel to remain on. There could be other loose connections or connection points that are intermittent that cause the panel to lose power, after which you need to reset the ELEMENT SELECT and PUMP switches before you can turn the POWER switch off and back on for the panel to come on.

I would take a close look at all of the wiring (especially around the power input and those 3 parts) to see if something may be loose. Take a look at the power cable input connector and plug as well as well as the power cable and wall plug itself. For example, if you jiggle the power cable connector at either the panel or wall end, are you able to make the panel turn off? IF yes, there's a loose connection somewhere. If anything with those parts is loose and toggles power off even just for a split second the panel will turn off and stay off even when power is restored (due to the SAFE START feature).

It could also be that the power in your location has issues and has occasional dropouts (power going off for a split second and immediately coming back). Sometimes you can notice this if lights or other equipment in the building flickers. Not all lights will flicker however, as it depends on the technology and how long the power is out for.

While I wouldn't recommend it for safety reasons, if you want to bypass the SAFE START feature that would stop the panel from staying off after a momentary power outage or loose connection issue. To do that refer to this wiring diagram: http://www.theelectricbrewery.com/images/interlock50A1BBL.jpg
Then take the wire that comes out of the top of the POWER KEY SWITCH and move it from point 8 on the SAFE START RELAY to the left coil side of the POWER IN CONTACTOR. This will ensure that if there's a power blip or a loose connection somewhere that the panel comes back on when the situation is restored.

I would still recommend going through the panel and power cord to ensure that there are no loose connections. If it's a power blip that happens occasionally then best to talk to your electrician/power company. Could be on the power company side or could be build wiring/power distribution.

Let us know how you make out. Good luck!

Kal