PH meter necessity and use

[LGarby]

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Looking for input on how many people have actually purchased and use a PH meter for every brew and if they feel it is really necessary.

I am almost completed with my build and one thing I still don't have is the PH meter. I plan to use 100% RO water so my HLT and MLT salt additions should be purely computed from EZ-water. It seems that the most important time Kal uses the PH meter is during the mash to make sure that the mash is acidic enough and it appears you are mostly concerned with this with really light beers where the .

I guess my question is even if you use the PH meter often throughout the brew process, how often are you adding lactic acid to adjust for a high PH vs just checking and having peace of mind that the PH is in normal range?

Just trying to determine if it is something that I really want/need to invest in and maintain. Thanks for your input.

-Loren

[kal]

Hi Loren,

Mash pH is most certainly the most important place to measure pH, at least for me. For some acidifying the sparge water would also matter. I really depends on your water.

The problem with using EZ water to calculate pH is that it's horribly inaccurate. This is not a slam at EZ water, but simply a fact due to the complexities involved with calculating pH. The calculated pH value that EZ comes up with sometimes gets close to the measured value, and sometimes is quite off. It's somewhat random. I remember someone here asking about this and I posted a dozen or so comparisons from my various brews to show how random it seems to be for me.

I know there's been talk around various forums about people coming up with new more accurate software however - not sure where that's at or how accurate it is or what the status is. Important to getting accurate values is ensuring that the data fed into the calculator is complete and accurate too of course.

At the end of the day I find a good pH meter to be a somewhat minor investment in the grand scheme of things when you factor in everything else. I'm actually still on my original probe tip too which is surprising. So the cost for me over the years has been very low. So far I've made 101 batches on my meter/first probe!

I use this meter: http://www.theelectricbrewery.com/parts-list-using?page=5

Good luck!

Kal

[kal]

Hi Loren,

Mash pH is most certainly the most important place to measure pH, at least for me. For some acidifying the sparge water would also matter. I really depends on your water.

The problem with using EZ water to calculate pH is that it's horribly inaccurate. This is not a slam at EZ water, but simply a fact due to the complexities involved with calculating pH. The calculated pH value that EZ comes up with sometimes gets close to the measured value, and sometimes is quite off. It's somewhat random. I remember someone here asking about this and I posted a dozen or so comparisons from my various brews to show how random it seems to be for me.

I know there's been talk around various forums about people coming up with new more accurate software however - not sure where that's at or how accurate it is or what the status is. Important to getting accurate values is ensuring that the data fed into the calculator is complete and accurate too of course.

At the end of the day I find a good pH meter to be a somewhat minor investment in the grand scheme of things when you factor in everything else. I'm actually still on my original probe tip too which is surprising. So the cost for me over the years has been very low. So far I've made 101 batches on my meter/first probe!

I use this meter: http://www.theelectricbrewery.com/parts-list-using?page=5

Good luck!

Kal

[LGarby]

Thanks Kal, after you take a PH reading, how often are you making an adjustment. Also, is that adjustment always to add lactic or do you sometime add a base to raise the PH? Only ever seen you mention adding lactic to lower it.

[kal]

[kal]

[McGruber]

I agree with everything Kal said. I don't think he said these exact words, but just because you use RO water, doesn't mean that your water is 7.0 pH. He's right also in saying that your water will buffer differently and require more or less acid than other people. You won't know unless you test it.

I've used 100% RO, 100% city water and often a mix of the two. I have added Lactic Acid to every batch. Depending on what source you quote, mash pH should be between 5.4 and 5.7 in order to keep alpha and beta amylase happy and doing their job. If you're much higher or lower than that you theoretically won't get full extraction of sugars - which means you're spending money on malt (sugar) and throwing unused sugar out with your spent grain. Higher efficiency means you're maximizing your grain costs. Sparge water should be in that 5.5 range too. Pre-boil pH should be between 5.2 and 5.4, and finished beer often finishes between 4.2 and 4.7 mostly for "correct" flavor/sensory perception and to keep bacterias out. I personally test all of those parameters.

If you're outside these specs and don't know it and don't care, then that's entirely up to you. This is spot on:
Kal- 'Is a pH meter required? Of course not. Brewers have been making beer for 10,000 years without them. Will a pH meter make better beer for you? Maybe. That depends on your water, the beers you're making, and how fussy you are about the quality of beer you want to make. Nobody can answer these questions for you. Nobody else knows your water or what beers you plan on making.'

I had problems with the pH meter Kal recommended and had to replace the tip after less than a year. It seems to be working better now though so I would say I do recommend it again. Just make sure the tip doesn't dry out - keep it in storage solution and calibrate on brew day before you use it.

[kal]

[kal]

[McGruber]

[LGarby]

Thanks for the input guys. Does the meter ship with the tip in solution somehow to keep it wet? How hard is it to keep the tip from drying out if you only brew once a month or so? I assume the cap isnt air tight so the liquid would evaporate over time and I don't anticipate brewing as often as you.

[kal]

[kal]

[McGruber]

[kal]

Yep - Mine came with a little chunk of spongy material.

Kal

[kal]

Yep - Mine came with a little chunk of spongy material.

Kal

[LarMoeCur]

[Joebrewing]

I would suggest looking at a cheap ph meter. I switched away from Hanna when I needed to replace the probe because it was cheaper to go with another manufacturer.

[Ozarks Mountain Brew]

I just buy the cheap 12.99 meters once a year, I call them throw away models, once calibrated they last about a year, they get ruined by using them at the mash temp form the heat messing up the cheap plastic lenses

[LarMoeCur]

[SD Endorf]

Much discussion in multiple brewing forums regarding the cheap crappy Ph meters on the market.
The cheap sticks are worthless. Test strips are highly inaccurate.
I finally purchased the Milwaukee MW102 a few years ago and is still going strong. Very accurate.
I only test mash Ph 10 minutes after mash in (after adding lactic or soda depending on the recipe) to determine if my software (bruinwater) is accurate. If mash Ph is spot on, I don't test boil or final Ph because that ship has already sailed.
Mash Ph is critical. It can make the difference between a good beer and a competition beer.

[LGarby]

great, thank you everyone for all of your input.

[kal]

I've definitely heard lots of good things about the Milwaukee MW102: http://amzn.to/2vkDdGP

Kal

[kal]

I've definitely heard lots of good things about the Milwaukee MW102: http://amzn.to/2vkDdGP

Kal

[mjo2125]

SD,

what's your experience with the Bru'n Water software? As the website says, there's a lot of brewing water programs out there.

[LarMoeCur]