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Using an oxygen machine

 
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Ozarks Mountain Brew



Joined: 22 May 2013
Posts: 734
Location: The Ozark Mountains of Missouri


PostLink    Posted: Mon Jul 08, 2019 4:13 pm    Post subject: Using an oxygen machine Reply with quote


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Has anyone thought about using an oxygen machine for brewing, I have both bottles and the machine, it seems like a very inexpensive way to oxygenate your beer, what are your thoughts

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dp Brewing Company



Joined: 08 Jul 2013
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Location: Midwest

Drinking: Black Sheep NEIPA, Rye Not Today, Kick of the Irish

Working on: RIS Barrel Aged


PostLink    Posted: Mon Jul 08, 2019 6:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't see any reason why it wouldn't work.
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kal
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Joined: 12 Dec 2010
Posts: 9882
Location: Ottawa, Canada

Drinking: German Lager, Electric Hop Candy Jr, Scottish 70/-, Cali Common, Maibock, Helles, Russian Imperial Stout, Black Butte Porter

Working on: Weizen


PostLink    Posted: Mon Jul 08, 2019 6:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Not sure about this.

What % of the output is O2? The lower it is, the longer it will take. An O2 tank is 100% pure O2.

How fast does it flow? (i.e. How many LPM?) Can you measure it? Whenever I've used pure O2 with a very fine carb stone I use a flow meter to measure the flow rate and flow at 1 litre per minute (LPM) and do the following:
Up to 1.060 ales: 60 seconds per 5 gallons at 1 LPM
Above 1.060 ale and lagers up to 1.060: 120 seconds per 5 gallons at 1 LPM

Lastly, these machines are meant for humans to breath in, usually through a breathing mask or small hoses in the nose (nasal cannula) like so:



Neither are blocked in any way. Are you sure the oxygen machine has enough available PSI pressure to push through a fine carb stone? There would be no reason for the machine designers to include much pressure as it's not required. In fact, it could even be unsafe. Normally you'd use a carb stone to oxygenate with pure O2 as the contact is much better due to the tiny bubbles and you don't need to do more than 1-2 minutes for a 5 gallon batch. If you were to (say) only dangle a hose in the wort the bubbles would be huge and very little O2 would be absorbed by the wort and you'd end up having to run it a very long time like one of these: https://shop.theelectricbrewery.com/pages/atmosphere-based-aeration-system-with-pump-and-diffusion-stone

I've used many methods over the years, including:

Pure O2: https://shop.theelectricbrewery.com/pages/pure-oxygen-aeration-system-with-tank-and-diffusion-stone
Agitating rod: https://shop.theelectricbrewery.com/pages/fizz-x-wort-agitating-rod
And the previous link above with the small pump. I have all 3.

I prefer the agitating rod method. Quick to use and quickest to clean as it has no fragile (very fine) carb stone.
Never had fermentation issues, yeast health issues, or un-attenuation issues.

Kal

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Ozarks Mountain Brew



Joined: 22 May 2013
Posts: 734
Location: The Ozark Mountains of Missouri


PostLink    Posted: Mon Jul 08, 2019 7:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

it has a regulator and range from 0 to 5, I could be wrong but I believe it's litters per minute, it does have a safety valve for a blockage and pretty much the same hose as my diffusion stone
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kal
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Joined: 12 Dec 2010
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Location: Ottawa, Canada

Drinking: German Lager, Electric Hop Candy Jr, Scottish 70/-, Cali Common, Maibock, Helles, Russian Imperial Stout, Black Butte Porter

Working on: Weizen


PostLink    Posted: Mon Jul 08, 2019 7:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

So I guess you don't know what kind of PSI it can push and whether it would push through a fine carb stone or not. You could always try it and see.

You didn't mention what % of the output is O2. It has to be somewhere between 20% (the air we breath) and 100%. At 20% it's impossible to over-oxygenate. At 100% you can.


Kal

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Ozarks Mountain Brew



Joined: 22 May 2013
Posts: 734
Location: The Ozark Mountains of Missouri


PostLink    Posted: Mon Jul 08, 2019 9:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

this is what I have

https://www.oxygendirect.com/home-oxygen/philips-respironics-everflo-q-oxygen-concentrator-5-lpm?utm_medium=pla&utm_source=google&sku_id=656&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIm6Hui6em4wIVCYbICh2wzgdSEAYYASABEgJrE_D_BwE

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kal
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Joined: 12 Dec 2010
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Location: Ottawa, Canada

Drinking: German Lager, Electric Hop Candy Jr, Scottish 70/-, Cali Common, Maibock, Helles, Russian Imperial Stout, Black Butte Porter

Working on: Weizen


PostLink    Posted: Mon Jul 08, 2019 10:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Ozarks,

Afraid I don't have time to go through all the details and manuals to try and figure out if it'll answer the questions I have.
I pointed out some issues that could arise. Feel free to dig and/or contact the manufacturer to get answers. I would bet some of the things may not be listed in the specs or manual as you're not using the device the way it was intended so the manufacturer would not be required to list those pieces of information.

Good luck!

Kal

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Ozarks Mountain Brew



Joined: 22 May 2013
Posts: 734
Location: The Ozark Mountains of Missouri


PostLink    Posted: Tue Jul 09, 2019 3:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I was reading the manual and I couldn't believe the advertising crap they add to these, you could reduce the manual to 1 page if you ask me, the only thing I found was 90-96% oxygen from 0.5 to 5 LP it doesn't say how much pressure but I think it should be fine since it is free nothing to lose except one beer Smile
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dp Brewing Company



Joined: 08 Jul 2013
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Location: Midwest

Drinking: Black Sheep NEIPA, Rye Not Today, Kick of the Irish

Working on: RIS Barrel Aged


PostLink    Posted: Tue Jul 09, 2019 11:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm still under the impression it will work perfectly fine for your application. If anything put a stone on there and put in some water to see how will the oxygen comes out the tube. The make the o2 stones in 2 mil if the .5 mill doesn't work. I used a breathing treatment machine for years. It was just pushing room air through a stone. Worked on both .5 and 2 mil.
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kal
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Joined: 12 Dec 2010
Posts: 9882
Location: Ottawa, Canada

Drinking: German Lager, Electric Hop Candy Jr, Scottish 70/-, Cali Common, Maibock, Helles, Russian Imperial Stout, Black Butte Porter

Working on: Weizen


PostLink    Posted: Tue Jul 09, 2019 12:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Agreed. Given that it's close to 100% pure, if you can do 1 LPM flow through a .5 or 2 mil stone (.5 preferred) you'd be able to oxygenate in a minute or two per my previous post. Might as well try it!

This is definitely not a cheap way to oxygenate given the cost of these machines, but if you already have it, why not? Curious to hear how it works out. Maybe post a video of it pumping through a stone at 1 LPM and we can let you know how it looks.

Kal

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Ozarks Mountain Brew



Joined: 22 May 2013
Posts: 734
Location: The Ozark Mountains of Missouri


PostLink    Posted: Tue Jul 09, 2019 12:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I also have an inline threaded stone that threads into a tee that I could use as I'm adding wort to the fermenter, this should be fun, thanks guys

https://www.homebrewing.org/12-NPT-x-38-Barb-SS-Inline-Diffusion-Stone_p_4530.html?utm_source=google&utm_medium=shopping&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIoPmOvr2o4wIVlYzICh0AmQb-EAQYBSABEgKXIvD_BwE

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