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Deschutes Black Butte Porter
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mtbr_brewer



Joined: 07 Nov 2016
Posts: 6
Location: Omaha, NE


PostLink    Posted: Wed Aug 30, 2017 2:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote


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Planning to brew this on Saturday, and was looking into my water adjustments. I am using RO water, so I build everything from scratch. I was using the EZ Water Calculator, but I couldn't find a way to get the calcium to 129 only using calcium chloride and gypsum, while keeping the chloride and sulfate where they need to be. Kal do you ever use slaked lime (pickling lime)? Any suggestions on it's use (can I use it in mash and boil)? Any insight would be appreciated!
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kal
Forum Administrator


Joined: 12 Dec 2010
Posts: 10077
Location: Ottawa, Canada

Drinking: German Lager, Electric Hop Candy Jr, Scottish 70/-, Cali Common, Maibock, Helles, Russian Imperial Stout, Black Butte Porter

Working on: Weizen


PostLink    Posted: Wed Aug 30, 2017 3:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mtbr_brewer wrote:
Planning to brew this on Saturday, and was looking into my water adjustments. I am using RO water, so I build everything from scratch. I was using the EZ Water Calculator, but I couldn't find a way to get the calcium to 129 only using calcium chloride and gypsum, while keeping the chloride and sulfate where they need to be. Kal do you ever use slaked lime (pickling lime)? Any suggestions on it's use (can I use it in mash and boil)? Any insight would be appreciated!

How close can you get?

My water's close to RO so I pulled up the spreadsheet and dropped my source numbers to 0, and was able to get really close:

Target: Ca=129, Mg=10, Na=16, Cl=89, S04=136
I got: Ca=129, Mg=10, Na=16, Cl=86, S04=136

By using Gypsum, Calc Chloride, Epsom Salt, Baking Soda, and some Chalk.

That said, you can probably leave out the Baking Soda and that would reduce Na to 0 as it's really not needed. For more info why see my Water Adjustment article: http://www.theelectricbrewery.com/water-adjustment

A cut & paste:

Quote:
Keeping Sodium very low in most beers is the goal. Our water starts with a Sodium level of 16 and for the most part we leave it there for most beers as lower amounts of Sodium produces a cleaner flavour. If you are starting with a Sodium level that is lower, feel free to add some Baking Soda to raise the level slightly to match our recommended targets but do not feel it is required. If our starting Sodium was at 5 or 10, we'd probably leave it at that. If your Sodium is much higher than 30 however you may want to consider diluting with RO or distilled water.


Kal

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mtbr_brewer



Joined: 07 Nov 2016
Posts: 6
Location: Omaha, NE


PostLink    Posted: Wed Aug 30, 2017 3:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

kal wrote:
mtbr_brewer wrote:
Planning to brew this on Saturday, and was looking into my water adjustments. I am using RO water, so I build everything from scratch. I was using the EZ Water Calculator, but I couldn't find a way to get the calcium to 129 only using calcium chloride and gypsum, while keeping the chloride and sulfate where they need to be. Kal do you ever use slaked lime (pickling lime)? Any suggestions on it's use (can I use it in mash and boil)? Any insight would be appreciated!

How close can you get? My water's close to RO and I pulled up the spreadsheet and dropped my source numbers to 0, and was able to get really close:

Target: Ca=129, Mg=10, Na=16, Cl=89, S04=136
I got: Ca=129, Mg=10, Na=16, Cl=86, S04=136

By using Gypsum, Calc Chloride, Epsom Salt, Baking Soda, and some Chalk.

Kal


Hey Kal,

I hadn't been using any Chalk in my calculations. Looks like that might be an easier way to get to those calcium numbers! Thanks for the quick response!
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kal
Forum Administrator


Joined: 12 Dec 2010
Posts: 10077
Location: Ottawa, Canada

Drinking: German Lager, Electric Hop Candy Jr, Scottish 70/-, Cali Common, Maibock, Helles, Russian Imperial Stout, Black Butte Porter

Working on: Weizen


PostLink    Posted: Wed Aug 30, 2017 3:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Good luck! Keep in mind that the numbers are not absolutes. Get close and I'm sure it'll be fine.

Kal

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GrumpyWally



Joined: 06 Mar 2015
Posts: 56
Location: San Diego, CA

Drinking: California Common, Schwarzbier, Roggenbier, Tripwire Tripel

Working on: Dubbel, Brown Porter


PostLink    Posted: Sat Sep 02, 2017 3:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

So here's what I did for my RO water when brewing this recipe:

Initially to the HLT: 13.0 g CaSO4, 2.2 g NaCl, 7.4 g MgSO4, 8.0 g CaCl2. Make sure to use "canning salt" (pure NaCl) - I used table salt the first time and there is a difference in the results (IMHO).

To the MLT after drawing strike water before dough-in: 2.5 g Ca(OH)2.
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idingle



Joined: 20 Nov 2014
Posts: 27
Location: Alberta


PostLink    Posted: Sat Sep 23, 2017 10:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm planning on brewing this next and doing one keg as a cherry porter. I've got some pure pasteurized cherry juice from the the Okanagan and am looking for advice on how much juice to add to create a good cherry porter. I figure I'll wait until primary fermentation pretty much wraps up and then add the juice. I don't see the value of racking into a secondary. (but I could be convinced with a persuasive argument! Smile)
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kal
Forum Administrator


Joined: 12 Dec 2010
Posts: 10077
Location: Ottawa, Canada

Drinking: German Lager, Electric Hop Candy Jr, Scottish 70/-, Cali Common, Maibock, Helles, Russian Imperial Stout, Black Butte Porter

Working on: Weizen


PostLink    Posted: Sat Sep 23, 2017 10:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

idingle wrote:
I'm planning on brewing this next and doing one keg as a cherry porter. I've got some pure pasteurized cherry juice from the the Okanagan and am looking for advice on how much juice to add to create a good cherry porter.

Add a little bit at a time, stirring gently, until the taste is to your liking. Go slow, as you can't go backwards if you overdo it. Everyone has different tastes and different juices will have different 'potencies' so there's no "correct" set amount. Good luck!

Kal

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jcav



Joined: 21 Sep 2011
Posts: 182
Location: Central Florida


PostLink    Posted: Sat Sep 23, 2017 11:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I am drinking one of the last pints from my batch right now. A solid recipe and a great Porter. Your idea of adding cherries to one of your kegs is interesting. I think this Porter would take well to adding cherries. Just a little juice goes a long way so take Kal's advice. Be sure to post back how it comes out. Good Luck!

John

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jcat5150



Joined: 14 Oct 2017
Posts: 2
Location: NORCAL BABY


PostLink    Posted: Sun Oct 15, 2017 2:14 pm    Post subject: Yeast Reply with quote

Hi folks. New member to what looks like a great board.

Here in the next week or two I plan on doing my first all-grain batch after a couple hundred gallons of extract and partial mash brews. A Black Butte clone (somewhat different recipe than the start of this thread) is the big winner for my first go-round. My ingredient supplier was fresh out of 1968 when I ordered ingredients the other day. I've always thought about trying to culture yeast from store bought beers. Therefore, I started the process from sediment from the bottom of a Black Butte yesterday. However, I can't find any information if this is actually the yeast the beer was fermented with and I've read that some brewers use different yeast for bottle conditioning than for brewing. Anyone know the deal here?

Cheers.

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kal
Forum Administrator


Joined: 12 Dec 2010
Posts: 10077
Location: Ottawa, Canada

Drinking: German Lager, Electric Hop Candy Jr, Scottish 70/-, Cali Common, Maibock, Helles, Russian Imperial Stout, Black Butte Porter

Working on: Weizen


PostLink    Posted: Sun Oct 15, 2017 9:56 pm    Post subject: Re: Yeast Reply with quote

jcat5150 wrote:
Hi folks. New member to what looks like a great board.

Here in the next week or two I plan on doing my first all-grain batch after a couple hundred gallons of extract and partial mash brews. A Black Butte clone (somewhat different recipe than the start of this thread) is the big winner for my first go-round. My ingredient supplier was fresh out of 1968 when I ordered ingredients the other day. I've always thought about trying to culture yeast from store bought beers. Therefore, I started the process from sediment from the bottom of a Black Butte yesterday. However, I can't find any information if this is actually the yeast the beer was fermented with and I've read that some brewers use different yeast for bottle conditioning than for brewing. Anyone know the deal here?

Cheers.

Welcome to the forum!

I haven't heard that this beer is bottle conditioned on different yeast. In fact, I would expect it to be force carb'ed, and you'll probably find very little yeast.

Have you considered buying 1968 through another supplier? See the list here:

http://www.theelectricbrewery.com/Wyeast-1968-London-ESB-Ale-Yeast

Cheers!

Kal

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jcat5150



Joined: 14 Oct 2017
Posts: 2
Location: NORCAL BABY


PostLink    Posted: Tue Oct 17, 2017 6:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think they have it back in stock now. Deschutes claims it is a bottle conditioned beer right on the label. We shall see if I can harvest anything or not....I'll get some 1968 enroute if I can't. It will be a couple weeks before I can brew anyway.

CHEERS.

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sillbeer



Joined: 15 Sep 2016
Posts: 46
Location: West Point, UT


PostLink    Posted: Wed Oct 18, 2017 10:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Picked up all the ingredients for this from my local brew store today and plan on brewing this on Saturday. Can't wait to try it out.
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Tennessee



Joined: 04 Apr 2015
Posts: 112
Location: Tennessee


PostLink    Posted: Thu Oct 19, 2017 12:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Do yourself a favor and add so bourbon & oak!

sillbeer wrote:
Picked up all the ingredients for this from my local brew store today and plan on brewing this on Saturday. Can't wait to try it out.

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sillbeer



Joined: 15 Sep 2016
Posts: 46
Location: West Point, UT


PostLink    Posted: Fri Oct 20, 2017 7:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'll probably do the oak and bourbon to one fermenter. How much do you suggest?
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kal
Forum Administrator


Joined: 12 Dec 2010
Posts: 10077
Location: Ottawa, Canada

Drinking: German Lager, Electric Hop Candy Jr, Scottish 70/-, Cali Common, Maibock, Helles, Russian Imperial Stout, Black Butte Porter

Working on: Weizen


PostLink    Posted: Fri Oct 20, 2017 7:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Check out my "how to oak beer" here for some suggestions on amounts and how to proceed: http://www.theelectricbrewery.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=30859

Good luck!

Kal

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rivetcatcher



Joined: 21 Apr 2016
Posts: 118
Location: Thailand

Drinking: Timothy Taylor Landlord / Hop Candy Jr

Working on: Juicy Bits


PostLink    Posted: Wed Jan 02, 2019 2:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

This will be my next brew and in my LHBS I have a choice of 2 Chocolate malts.

Both are by Thomas Fawcett, one is a 950EBC (482 SRM) Chocolate Malt and the other is a 500EBC (254SRM) Pale Chocolate Malt. The 950 has a strong coffee taste whilst the other is milder.

I read in the recipe that you can split 50/50. What would your suggestion be with the above malts for this beer? One of the above or a split.

Thanks in advance.

Rivet
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kal
Forum Administrator


Joined: 12 Dec 2010
Posts: 10077
Location: Ottawa, Canada

Drinking: German Lager, Electric Hop Candy Jr, Scottish 70/-, Cali Common, Maibock, Helles, Russian Imperial Stout, Black Butte Porter

Working on: Weizen


PostLink    Posted: Wed Jan 02, 2019 2:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The recipe says:

Quote:
*To remain true to the original recipe split the Chocolate Malt between higher lovibond American Chocolate Malt and lower lovibond British Chocolate Malt. If you can't, no big deal, it's doubtful that the difference would be noticed.


So to follow the recipe, go 50/50 as you have both.

If you want more of a roasted taste, go with 100% of the higher kilned stuff. If you want it smoother (less roasted) go with 100% of the lower kilned stuff. Completely up to you.

Kal

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rivetcatcher



Joined: 21 Apr 2016
Posts: 118
Location: Thailand

Drinking: Timothy Taylor Landlord / Hop Candy Jr

Working on: Juicy Bits


PostLink    Posted: Wed Jan 02, 2019 5:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ok, I think Iíll split it 50/50, Iíve never used chocolate malt before so not sure how strong / harsh the higher killed stuff is and vice versa for the lighter stuff.


Looking forward to giving this a go. Itíll make a change from the usual pale beers
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rivetcatcher



Joined: 21 Apr 2016
Posts: 118
Location: Thailand

Drinking: Timothy Taylor Landlord / Hop Candy Jr

Working on: Juicy Bits


PostLink    Posted: Thu Jan 17, 2019 1:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

You know that moment when you have your mash water up to temp and your ready to dough in... then realise that the brew shop has sent you 17lbs of pale rye malt instead of pale malt..... yeah that moment 😖
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kal
Forum Administrator


Joined: 12 Dec 2010
Posts: 10077
Location: Ottawa, Canada

Drinking: German Lager, Electric Hop Candy Jr, Scottish 70/-, Cali Common, Maibock, Helles, Russian Imperial Stout, Black Butte Porter

Working on: Weizen


PostLink    Posted: Thu Jan 17, 2019 1:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

That would make on interesting beer! 😉

Kal

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