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15 Gallon HLT (Will HERMS Coil Be Exposed)
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NervousDad




Joined: 21 Jun 2015
Posts: 24



PostLink    Posted: Tue Jun 23, 2015 12:23 am    Post subject: 15 Gallon HLT (Will HERMS Coil Be Exposed) Reply with quote


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So I ordered a Stout 15 Gallon HERMS Electric HLT. If I do 5 gallon batches and I transfer 5 gallons to the Mash Tun, would this leave the Coils out of the water, does that matter?
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Gameface




Joined: 07 Feb 2015
Posts: 120
Location: West Jordan, UT


PostLink    Posted: Tue Jun 23, 2015 6:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Whatever portion of the coils that are exposed will not act as a heat exchanger. It will lower the efficiency of your system a bit, depending on how much of it is exposed.

Obviously you could replace the 5g after transferring to the MT, or just add you strike water to the MT and fill your HLT to just above the coils and heat it all up that way.
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huaco




Joined: 05 Apr 2012
Posts: 1506
Location: Burleson Texas


PostLink    Posted: Tue Jun 23, 2015 6:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Or, do what I do on my (3)15 gallon vessel brewery... heat strike water in the Boil Kettle and leave all the Hot Liquor in the HLT for mashing and sparging.
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kal
Forum Administrator



Joined: 12 Dec 2010
Posts: 11116
Location: Ottawa, Canada

Drinking: Pub Ale, Electric Creamsicle, Mild, Pliny the Younger, Belgian Dark Strong, Weizen, Russian Imperial Stout, Black Butte Porter


PostLink    Posted: Wed Jun 24, 2015 12:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Gameface wrote:
Whatever portion of the coils that are exposed will not act as a heat exchanger. It will lower the efficiency of your system a bit, depending on how much of it is exposed.

Obviously you could replace the 5g after transferring to the MT, or just add you strike water to the MT and fill your HLT to just above the coils and heat it all up that way.

+1 to both.

I have 20 gallon kettles. On some really high gravity beers where I want to make 10 gallons, I need to start with more than 20 gallons total because the grain absorbs too much water, so I fill the HLT and MLT separately at the start and heat the MLT water through HERMS.

Kal

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NervousDad




Joined: 21 Jun 2015
Posts: 24



PostLink    Posted: Wed Jun 24, 2015 12:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks guys!
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Roadie




Joined: 13 Oct 2013
Posts: 127
Location: Charleston, SC


PostLink    Posted: Wed Jun 24, 2015 12:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have 20 gallon kettles and brew 5 gallon batches all the time. I think it takes around 11 gallons to cover my HERMS coil so it's covered in the beginning but after I transfer water over to the mash tun they are only 1/2 covered. No big deal. I do recirculate the water in the HLT and it sprays on the coil when shooting back in. Put the lid on the HLT and don't worry about it. Make sure you turn the HLT element OFF when starting your sparge.
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NervousDad




Joined: 21 Jun 2015
Posts: 24



PostLink    Posted: Wed Jun 24, 2015 4:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Roadie wrote:
I have 20 gallon kettles and brew 5 gallon batches all the time. I think it takes around 11 gallons to cover my HERMS coil so it's covered in the beginning but after I transfer water over to the mash tun they are only 1/2 covered. No big deal. I do recirculate the water in the HLT and it sprays on the coil when shooting back in. Put the lid on the HLT and don't worry about it. Make sure you turn the HLT element OFF when starting your sparge.


I hope I didn't undersize my kettles. I'm switching from a 15g sabco RIMS and I was able to brew 10 gallon batches. It looks like with the HERMS I'm going to be limited to 5.
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kal
Forum Administrator



Joined: 12 Dec 2010
Posts: 11116
Location: Ottawa, Canada

Drinking: Pub Ale, Electric Creamsicle, Mild, Pliny the Younger, Belgian Dark Strong, Weizen, Russian Imperial Stout, Black Butte Porter


PostLink    Posted: Wed Jun 24, 2015 4:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

With the boil-off (1.9 gallon/hr), expansion (0.5 gallons on 13-14), and other losses (hops/trub/etc), I find 15g kettles too small to do 10g of packaged beer. I like to have 11.5-12 gallons post boil with 5.5-6 gallons per fermenter (I use two fermenters). After all loses I usually have exactly 5 gallons in two kegs, or just slightly more.

If I'm boiling for 90 mins, I start with 14.9 gallons in the boil kettle and there's more than .5 gallons extra due to thermal expansion. When I boil for 60 mins I start with 13.9 gallons.

So a 15 gallon boil kettle is definitely not big enough for how I like to brew.

I know a lot of brewers use 15.5 gallon kettles and "say" they make 10 gallon batches, but watching them brew I often see a non-vigorous boil, or only 4 gallons going into the 5 gallon kegs.

Kal

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NervousDad




Joined: 21 Jun 2015
Posts: 24



PostLink    Posted: Wed Jun 24, 2015 5:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Smile yeah I would say I ended up with about 9 gallons. It's rare for me to brew ten gallons so I guess I'll be okay. Btw I just order a 30amp panel the other day can't wait!! Going from a gas sabco to electric will be awesome.
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Roadie




Joined: 13 Oct 2013
Posts: 127
Location: Charleston, SC


PostLink    Posted: Wed Jun 24, 2015 8:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Also depends on the gravity. You may get away with 10 gallons of a summer beer. A retail place in town with the same setup as I have brews 15 gallon batches of lower gravity beers in their 20 gallon kettles. I didn't go with 15 gallon kettles as I wanted to be able to brew 10 gallons of a big beer without issue if I wanted to. 99.9% of the time we only brew 5 gallon batches and if that's what you do as well then no big deal.
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NervousDad




Joined: 21 Jun 2015
Posts: 24



PostLink    Posted: Sun Jun 28, 2015 12:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Roadie wrote:
Also depends on the gravity. You may get away with 10 gallons of a summer beer. A retail place in town with the same setup as I have brews 15 gallon batches of lower gravity beers in their 20 gallon kettles. I didn't go with 15 gallon kettles as I wanted to be able to brew 10 gallons of a big beer without issue if I wanted to. 99.9% of the time we only brew 5 gallon batches and if that's what you do as well then no big deal.


Thanks Roadie! Does the boil kettle thermowell get exposed when you make 5 gallon batches?
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Roadie




Joined: 13 Oct 2013
Posts: 127
Location: Charleston, SC


PostLink    Posted: Sun Jun 28, 2015 2:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

NervousDad wrote:
Roadie wrote:
Also depends on the gravity. You may get away with 10 gallons of a summer beer. A retail place in town with the same setup as I have brews 15 gallon batches of lower gravity beers in their 20 gallon kettles. I didn't go with 15 gallon kettles as I wanted to be able to brew 10 gallons of a big beer without issue if I wanted to. 99.9% of the time we only brew 5 gallon batches and if that's what you do as well then no big deal.


Thanks Roadie! Does the boil kettle thermowell get exposed when you make 5 gallon batches?


Only if I use 1.5 quarts of liquor per pound of grain or more so I usually use 1.5.
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NervousDad




Joined: 21 Jun 2015
Posts: 24



PostLink    Posted: Mon Jun 29, 2015 6:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I decided to upgrade to the 20 gallon tanks. Too bad Stout sold out of the 20 gallon HLT this morning Sad So I have to wait until August.

The Stout tanks the are the same diameter, but taller so the boil off should be the same. The thermowells also appear to be the same height so a 5/10 gallon batch wouldn't make a difference. Plus, I can fill all 20 gallons of the HLT for my session which will keep the HERMS coil submerged.
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Roadie




Joined: 13 Oct 2013
Posts: 127
Location: Charleston, SC


PostLink    Posted: Fri Jul 03, 2015 1:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

NervousDad wrote:
I decided to upgrade to the 20 gallon tanks. Too bad Stout sold out of the 20 gallon HLT this morning Sad So I have to wait until August.

The thermowells also appear to be the same height so a 5/10 gallon batch wouldn't make a difference.


20 gallon tanks are the most versatile for the size batches most home brewers brew. The waiting game does suck.

Don't forget almost everything in the design can be changed. That's one of the things I liked best about Stout tanks. I deleted the front thermowell/thermometer as you won't use it with Kal's control panel and it will never be as correct as the probes that connect to the panel. You can also move the location of the thermowells if it fits your setup better. On my MLT I wish the temperature thermowell was an inch lower but I didn't know where the mash would hit it when brewing 5 gallon batches.
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Gameface




Joined: 07 Feb 2015
Posts: 120
Location: West Jordan, UT


PostLink    Posted: Mon Jul 06, 2015 12:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

NervousDad wrote:
Roadie wrote:
Also depends on the gravity. You may get away with 10 gallons of a summer beer. A retail place in town with the same setup as I have brews 15 gallon batches of lower gravity beers in their 20 gallon kettles. I didn't go with 15 gallon kettles as I wanted to be able to brew 10 gallons of a big beer without issue if I wanted to. 99.9% of the time we only brew 5 gallon batches and if that's what you do as well then no big deal.


Thanks Roadie! Does the boil kettle thermowell get exposed when you make 5 gallon batches?


I realized today that I have almost never even looked at the dial thermometers on my kettles since going electric. Then, when I did start looking at them I realized they didn't agree with my PID readings, but my PIDs agree with my thermapen and I have a very high degree of confidence in the accuracy of my thermapen.
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Roadie




Joined: 13 Oct 2013
Posts: 127
Location: Charleston, SC


PostLink    Posted: Mon Jul 06, 2015 7:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Gameface wrote:
NervousDad wrote:
Roadie wrote:
Also depends on the gravity. You may get away with 10 gallons of a summer beer. A retail place in town with the same setup as I have brews 15 gallon batches of lower gravity beers in their 20 gallon kettles. I didn't go with 15 gallon kettles as I wanted to be able to brew 10 gallons of a big beer without issue if I wanted to. 99.9% of the time we only brew 5 gallon batches and if that's what you do as well then no big deal.


Thanks Roadie! Does the boil kettle thermowell get exposed when you make 5 gallon batches?


I realized today that I have almost never even looked at the dial thermometers on my kettles since going electric. Then, when I did start looking at them I realized they didn't agree with my PID readings, but my PIDs agree with my thermapen and I have a very high degree of confidence in the accuracy of my thermapen.


Boil kettle is no issue only the MLT.

Since I was never going to look at them I didn't want them getting in the way so had Stout delete that thermowell and thermometer as it just made sense to do it.
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NervousDad




Joined: 21 Jun 2015
Posts: 24



PostLink    Posted: Tue Jul 07, 2015 7:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

They no longer modify orders Sad I would prefer for them to remove them, now I'll have to get thermometers for them. For the boil kettle I like the thermometer to watch the whirlpool and chilling temps.
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Roadie




Joined: 13 Oct 2013
Posts: 127
Location: Charleston, SC


PostLink    Posted: Tue Jul 07, 2015 10:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

NervousDad wrote:
They no longer modify orders Sad


Wow, that sucks. I really liked being able to get the kettles the way I wanted them.
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foomench




Joined: 21 Feb 2012
Posts: 704
Location: Longmont, CO

Drinking: Pinot barrel aged quad

Working on: Flanders oude bruin in barrel, Flanders red fermenting to refill the barrel


PostLink    Posted: Wed Jul 08, 2015 12:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

NervousDad wrote:
They no longer modify orders Sad I would prefer for them to remove them, now I'll have to get thermometers for them.

Or a plug fitting.

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Roadie




Joined: 13 Oct 2013
Posts: 127
Location: Charleston, SC


PostLink    Posted: Wed Jul 08, 2015 12:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just such a clean look with them gone and out of the way. Here is a link to my setup w/photos.

http://www.homebrewtalk.com/brew-setups/almost-famous-brewing-42.html
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