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First brew on the new electric brewery

 
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zeppman




Joined: 01 Jun 2011
Posts: 138



PostLink    Posted: Sat Nov 05, 2011 5:36 am    Post subject: First brew on the new electric brewery Reply with quote


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Hey guys,

So I just completed my first brew on my electric brewery. My setup is nearly identical to Kal's. I brewed the following standard Pale ale recipe.

5 gal batch, 60 min boil
8lbs 2 row
2 lbs 4oz vienna
12 oz C20

1oz magnum @ 60
1oz cascade @ 15
1oz cascade @5
1oz cascade @1
S-04 yeast with pure O2

added 1g gypsum, 2ml lactic acid


I found, with a few exceptions, that this was the smoothest brew session that I have done. So much more exact than my old methods. I really enjoyed it.... until the chilling and cleanup. I know I am doing something wrong, so please provide some suggestions. I found the cleanup to be such a PITA compared to my previous brew sessions. And here is why:

-Instead of taking my old igloo mash tun and dumping it straight into a bag and hitting the tun with a hose, I had to scoop out the spent grain. That wasn't bad, until there was maybe 10% of the grain left, and I really couldn't scoop it out anymore. I eventually had to take the kettle off the table and fill it with water and poor it through a colander sitting in my sink a few times to get all the grain out. I then wiped it down with warm water and dried it.

- When it was time to chill, I connected my tubes and just cycled the wort through the tubes, pump, chiller and back into the boil kettle. I did this at a very slow rate. I then turned on my sink faucet to start the cooling, and pumped the wort into the carboy (no cooled wort went back into the kettle). I believe I did this at a slow enough rate, but still had trouble getting the last bit out of the boil kettle. The dip tube in the hop stopper seemed to suck air sooner than I thought it would. After playing with the valves and pump a bit, I was able to fill the carboy.

-I found cleaning the boil kettle and chiller was the most frustrating part. I had 4oz of spent hops in the kettle. I started by using my shop vac to try and suck some of the hops up. I soon realized I need a better, larger shop vac. I then removed the hop stopper assembly and rinsed it off in the sink. I found it difficult to get some of the hops out of the creases and the hops that made it into the hop stopper. I did not remove the dip tube but I know I left some hop particles inside hop stopper. I then went to pour hot water in the kettle and drained it (by gravity) into a bucket. This continued to leave a lot of hops behind. I had to do this several times before the water became clean enough that I decided to run it through the pump and chiller. After pumping hot water through the pump and chiller, I vacuumed out the remaining water and hop particles out of the kettle, and the remaining water out of the chiller, pumps, and HLT.

The total time was 6.5 hours. I had about a 40 min sparge, which I guess was a little short, but I didn't mind having a bit lower efficiency. Overall it was enjoyable, I just hope someone can help me plan my cleanup better.
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kal
Forum Administrator



Joined: 12 Dec 2010
Posts: 11114
Location: Ottawa, Canada

Drinking: Pub Ale, Electric Creamsicle, Mild, Pliny the Younger, Belgian Dark Strong, Weizen, Russian Imperial Stout, Black Butte Porter


PostLink    Posted: Sat Nov 05, 2011 4:17 pm    Post subject: Re: First brew on the new electric brewery Reply with quote

zeppman wrote:
-Instead of taking my old igloo mash tun and dumping it straight into a bag and hitting the tun with a hose, I had to scoop out the spent grain. That wasn't bad, until there was maybe 10% of the grain left, and I really couldn't scoop it out anymore. I eventually had to take the kettle off the table and fill it with water and poor it through a colander sitting in my sink a few times to get all the grain out. I then wiped it down with warm water and dried it.

Why are you catching every last spent grain with the colander? I scoop out about 95% like you and then the rest goes down the sink drain when I wash the kettle.

Quote:
- When it was time to chill, I connected my tubes and just cycled the wort through the tubes, pump, chiller and back into the boil kettle. I did this at a very slow rate. I then turned on my sink faucet to start the cooling, and pumped the wort into the carboy (no cooled wort went back into the kettle). I believe I did this at a slow enough rate, but still had trouble getting the last bit out of the boil kettle. The dip tube in the hop stopper seemed to suck air sooner than I thought it would. After playing with the valves and pump a bit, I was able to fill the carboy.

Yes, you need to pump really slow once the hop stopper's exposed to air.

Quote:
-I found cleaning the boil kettle and chiller was the most frustrating part. I had 4oz of spent hops in the kettle. I started by using my shop vac to try and suck some of the hops up. I soon realized I need a better, larger shop vac.

I just tilt my boil kettle over into the sink. It all goes down the drain. If there's a lot (like a 20+ oz IIPA) I may scoop some first into a bucket and put in our composte/food recycling.

Why suck it up? Are you wanting to use the trub/spent hops for something? Vacuuming will be slow.

Quote:
I then removed the hop stopper assembly and rinsed it off in the sink. I found it difficult to get some of the hops out of the creases and the hops that made it into the hop stopper.

Give it good rinse but don't try and get every last spec out. It won't matter. Some will come out next time, some will go in next time. I do a quick 60 second rinse.

Quote:
I then went to pour hot water in the kettle and drained it (by gravity) into a bucket. This continued to leave a lot of hops behind.

Yes, because you're simply diluting it every time instead of rinsing. Just dump it all in a sink and give it a rinse. I wipe/scrub with a sponge with the kettle tilted 90 degrees sideways. I wash with my sink arm. About 5 minutes of cleaning.

Having the sink right beside the boil kettle means I just tilt the kettle and dump out the hops & trub, then spray with the wash arm and watch the gunk all go down the sink. Quick scrub/wipe with a sponge and it's done.

Quote:
After pumping hot water through the pump and chiller, I vacuumed out the remaining water and hop particles out of the kettle, and the remaining water out of the chiller, pumps, and HLT.

Just dump it. No need to vacuum. Vacuuming would be very slow.

Kal

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zeppman




Joined: 01 Jun 2011
Posts: 138



PostLink    Posted: Sat Nov 05, 2011 4:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Kal,

Thanks for your response.

-So when cleaning your MLT, you take it off the table to rinse it and dump the grains? I guess I tried to get all the grains because I did not want to clog my drain. I'm assuming this probably won't happen though?

-I will pay better attention next time and slow the pump even more, and that is good to hear about cleaning the hop stopper.

- The problem with my setup is the sink is about 10 feet away from the BK on an adjacent wall. There was no other way to design my brew room. I did have one of the CF chiller hoses to rinse the BK, so I have that going, but no drain near by. I also do not have enough slack in my element cable and RTD cable, again due to where the control panel had to go. Disconnecting them isn't that difficult, but just another thing I was trying to avoid having to do.
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kal
Forum Administrator



Joined: 12 Dec 2010
Posts: 11114
Location: Ottawa, Canada

Drinking: Pub Ale, Electric Creamsicle, Mild, Pliny the Younger, Belgian Dark Strong, Weizen, Russian Imperial Stout, Black Butte Porter


PostLink    Posted: Sat Nov 05, 2011 4:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

zeppman wrote:
-So when cleaning your MLT, you take it off the table to rinse it and dump the grains?

After the grain has cooled I scoop out all the grains usign a little bowl as much as possible. Not much is left. I then take out the false bottom and give it a rinse/scrub in the sink using my sink wash arm. At this point there's very little grain left in the kettle, less than a handful. Once the boils done and boil kettle's cleaned up I move the MLT to where the boil kettle is and tilt it sideways to spray and clean it with the wash arm.

Having a second table to the left of my sink would be helpful as I could then clean it easier when I'm boiling. My new brewing room will allow me to do this.

Quote:
I guess I tried to get all the grains because I did not want to clog my drain. I'm assuming this probably won't happen though?

There's very little. Just a handful at most.

Quote:
The problem with my setup is the sink is about 10 feet away from the BK on an adjacent wall. There was no other way to design my brew room. I did have one of the CF chiller hoses to rinse the BK, so I have that going, but no drain near by. I also do not have enough slack in my element cable and RTD cable, again due to where the control panel had to go. Disconnecting them isn't that difficult, but just another thing I was trying to avoid having to do.

I'm not sure I understand. What does the distance from the sink to the brewing table have to do with where you put the pumps? I would keep the hoses short during norm use (recirc, sparging, etc). If you need a longer one for another step later, use one longer hose made just for that.

Kal

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We ship worldwide and support our products and customers for life.
Purchasing through our affiliate links helps support our site at no extra cost to you. We thank you!
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zeppman




Joined: 01 Jun 2011
Posts: 138



PostLink    Posted: Sat Nov 05, 2011 6:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
The problem with my setup is the sink is about 10 feet away from the BK on an adjacent wall. There was no other way to design my brew room. I did have one of the CF chiller hoses to rinse the BK, so I have that going, but no drain near by. I also do not have enough slack in my element cable and RTD cable, again due to where the control panel had to go. Disconnecting them isn't that difficult, but just another thing I was trying to avoid having to do.

I'm not sure I understand. What does the distance from the sink to the brewing table have to do with where you put the pumps? I would keep the hoses short during norm use (recirc, sparging, etc). If you need a longer one for another step later, use one longer hose made just for that.

Kal[/quote]

Sorry for the confusing wording. I'm not talking about my pumps. I'm talking about cleaning the BK after the brew. I don't have a sink near the brew table and BK where I can just tip the BK over and rinse it straight in to the sink. Also, I can't really tip the kettle unless I disconnect the heating element cable from the control panel, and the RTD from the probe mounted in the back of the BK. This is because cables are just barely long enough for my setup. I will pull on them if I tip the kettle.

I guess I can disconnect the cables, and get a large bucket to place on the floor near the BK when it is time to wash it out.
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zeppman




Joined: 01 Jun 2011
Posts: 138



PostLink    Posted: Wed Nov 09, 2011 3:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Brewed another batch last night, and it went much better. The brewing was even smoother than the first time, and clean up went a lot better. Still not completely ideal, but I feel that with some more practice, things will only get better. I connected a hose and nozzle to my sink, and had a large bucket near the kettles. I would tip the kettles, spray them with the hose and rinse them into the bucket.

I can't wait for the next brew session!
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kal
Forum Administrator



Joined: 12 Dec 2010
Posts: 11114
Location: Ottawa, Canada

Drinking: Pub Ale, Electric Creamsicle, Mild, Pliny the Younger, Belgian Dark Strong, Weizen, Russian Imperial Stout, Black Butte Porter


PostLink    Posted: Wed Nov 09, 2011 4:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It certainly takes a few sessions to get confortable with the whole thing, after which it becomes second nature! I only recently noticed how smoothly I had my process laid out in the basement brewery when I started brewing in the garage 3 months ago after we moved to a new house. Somewhat of a disorganized mess since I'm in an area (the garage) that isn't dedicated to brewing and doesn't have my nice wash arm/sink hooked up. Can't wait to be back in the basement and organized with everything on shelves in the right spots!

Kal

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zeppman




Joined: 01 Jun 2011
Posts: 138



PostLink    Posted: Thu Nov 17, 2011 2:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I brewed another batch the other day, and had to leave about 1 - 1.5gal in the bottom of the bk. I had 6 oz of pellet hops in there (wanted to finish with 5.25 in the fermenter). I really had it down to a near trickle once the hop stopper was exposed. There wasn't even that much gunk built up on the exposed parts of the stopper. Once it loses suction, is there anyway to get that last gallon or so in the carboy?
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kal
Forum Administrator



Joined: 12 Dec 2010
Posts: 11114
Location: Ottawa, Canada

Drinking: Pub Ale, Electric Creamsicle, Mild, Pliny the Younger, Belgian Dark Strong, Weizen, Russian Imperial Stout, Black Butte Porter


PostLink    Posted: Thu Nov 17, 2011 2:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

zeppman wrote:
I brewed another batch the other day, and had to leave about 1 - 1.5gal in the bottom of the bk. I had 6 oz of pellet hops in there (wanted to finish with 5.25 in the fermenter). I really had it down to a near trickle once the hop stopper was exposed. There wasn't even that much gunk built up on the exposed parts of the stopper. Once it loses suction, is there anyway to get that last gallon or so in the carboy?

Yes. Stop pumping (close the valve), wait for the hop stopper to fill up again, and then continue pumping.

If you accidentally emptied the hose between the kettle and the pump you may have to manually fill it up first as with very little wort left in the kettle it may not flow down to the pump automatically.

The trick is the watch the hose at the output of the boil kettle and turn the pump valve way down as soon as you get any air bubbles. This is one reason why I like the tubing I use over hard-plumbed stainless lines: You can somewhat see through the tubing.

Kal

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zeppman




Joined: 01 Jun 2011
Posts: 138



PostLink    Posted: Thu Nov 17, 2011 2:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

kal wrote:


If you accidentally emptied the hose between the kettle and the pump you may have to manually fill it up first as with very little wort left in the kettle it may not flow down to the pump automatically.



Kal



How do you manually fill it up?
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kal
Forum Administrator



Joined: 12 Dec 2010
Posts: 11114
Location: Ottawa, Canada

Drinking: Pub Ale, Electric Creamsicle, Mild, Pliny the Younger, Belgian Dark Strong, Weizen, Russian Imperial Stout, Black Butte Porter


PostLink    Posted: Thu Nov 17, 2011 3:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

zeppman wrote:
kal wrote:


If you accidentally emptied the hose between the kettle and the pump you may have to manually fill it up first as with very little wort left in the kettle it may not flow down to the pump automatically.



Kal



How do you manually fill it up?


- Close the pump and boil kettle valves
- Remove the hose
- Fill the hose from the sink holding both ends at the same height so that the water stays in
- Still holding both ends at the same height, attach one end to the pump input
- Attach other end to the boil kettle output

Basically just fill it with water and re-attach it, being careful not to spill too much if any.

I've never had to do this, but I do have a QD to tap adapter (see here) that I use for cleaning or filling the HLT from the tap. It would make it simpler as you'd only disconnect the kettle end, attach it to the sink, then flush it with water.

Kal

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zeppman




Joined: 01 Jun 2011
Posts: 138



PostLink    Posted: Thu Nov 17, 2011 3:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks Kal,

Wouldn't you need to be concerned about infection at that point? You are taking un-sanitized water and and running it through the pump chiller... unless I'm misunderstanding something.
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kal
Forum Administrator



Joined: 12 Dec 2010
Posts: 11114
Location: Ottawa, Canada

Drinking: Pub Ale, Electric Creamsicle, Mild, Pliny the Younger, Belgian Dark Strong, Weizen, Russian Imperial Stout, Black Butte Porter


PostLink    Posted: Thu Nov 17, 2011 3:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

You're absolutely right... don't do it if that worries you. Though I find (generally speaking) people worry too much about sanitation/infection. The water coming out of your tap shouldn't have too much of anything nasty in it and your chiller and lines should already be clean before you started.

The trick (IMHO) is to clean everything correctly after so that there's basically nothing for nasties to grow on.

Kal

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zeppman




Joined: 01 Jun 2011
Posts: 138



PostLink    Posted: Thu Nov 17, 2011 3:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ok, well I'll keep that in mind for the next brew. I plan on running a few experiments with just water before my next brew. I want to make sure I'm not losing suction because the dip tube is not correctly "seated" in the outlet port of the kettle... I was thinking maybe I started to suck air there... since the bottom of the hop stopper was not that clogged up when I removed it.

Kal, do you think that since isn't a groove in the dip tube (like there is in the blichmann dip tubes), I could be losing suction at that connection?
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kal
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Joined: 12 Dec 2010
Posts: 11114
Location: Ottawa, Canada

Drinking: Pub Ale, Electric Creamsicle, Mild, Pliny the Younger, Belgian Dark Strong, Weizen, Russian Imperial Stout, Black Butte Porter


PostLink    Posted: Thu Nov 17, 2011 4:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

No, the lack of groove isn't causing issues.

I also originally lost suction a few times with the Hop Stopper and did tests with water and they went extremely well since there was no trub or hops. That's when Dennis (maker of the Hop Stopper) simply told me to slow the pump right down (really slow) when the Hop Stopper gets exposed to air.

Kal

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zeppman




Joined: 01 Jun 2011
Posts: 138



PostLink    Posted: Thu Nov 17, 2011 4:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't doubt it that you have to really slow it down... I am just confused because if I slowed it down anymore, it would of become a drip. I had about 6.25 gal in the kettle. It took me nearly 30 min. to get 4.5 or so in the carboy... that's how slow I was going with it.
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