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The Electric Pale Ale
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kal
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Joined: 12 Dec 2010
Posts: 8062
Location: Ottawa, Canada

Drinking: American Lager, Electric Hop Candy Jr, Scottish 70/-, German Pilsner, Russian Imperial Stout, Black Butte Porter, Saison, Kölsch

Working on: Kölsch, Janet's Brown Ale


PostLink    Posted: Tue Dec 09, 2014 5:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote


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For what it's worth, like many brewers I haven't done a secondary fermentation for many years now. There's no need for it given the high quality yeasts we use today.

There was a time (many years ago) when you were supposed to rack off the primary after high krausen because the yeast would throw all sorts of nasty stuff you didn't want around. Those days are gone. The need for secondary fermentations no longer exist. I suggest you follow the recipe as outlined.

Cheers and welcome to the forum Jim!

Kal

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jim@gsp



Joined: 09 Dec 2014
Posts: 8
Location: Gig Harbor, WA


PostLink    Posted: Tue Dec 09, 2014 1:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

That is the clarification that I needed, Kal.

Thanks for that!
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captacl



Joined: 30 Sep 2014
Posts: 37
Location: Bethlehem, PA USA


PostLink    Posted: Wed Dec 10, 2014 2:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have a question about grist ratio. Why do you choose 1.25qts per gallon for some recipes (like this one) and 1.5qts for others (Blonde & Pilsner). From what I have determined based on my initial runoff gravity, I have not getting full conversion. I don't recall if I measured the initial runoff from the Blonde so I can't exclude grist ratio as a factor. The only other thing I can think of is with the grind of my malt. Even using .035 with the maris otter i still noticed some grains that weren't crushed enough to let water in to convert the starches. I was afraid to go much tighter then that. Any thoughts?

Anthony
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kal
Forum Administrator


Joined: 12 Dec 2010
Posts: 8062
Location: Ottawa, Canada

Drinking: American Lager, Electric Hop Candy Jr, Scottish 70/-, German Pilsner, Russian Imperial Stout, Black Butte Porter, Saison, Kölsch

Working on: Kölsch, Janet's Brown Ale


PostLink    Posted: Wed Dec 10, 2014 4:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

A higher water to grist ratio results in a more fermentable wort. Beers that I want to maximize attenuation, I will use a higher water to grist ratio.

If you have a recirculating system similar to the one outlined on this website, go with a LOOSER crush, not TIGHTER to achieve higher efficiency/better conversion. For complete details as to why, read our grain mill article: http://www.theelectricbrewery.com/grain-mill

Kal

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Tungsten



Joined: 06 Dec 2014
Posts: 274
Location: Buffalo, NY


PostLink    Posted: Wed Dec 10, 2014 3:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

captacl wrote:
I have a question about grist ratio. Why do you choose 1.25qts per gallon for some recipes (like this one) and 1.5qts for others (Blonde & Pilsner). From what I have determined based on my initial runoff gravity, I have not getting full conversion. I don't recall if I measured the initial runoff from the Blonde so I can't exclude grist ratio as a factor. The only other thing I can think of is with the grind of my malt. Even using .035 with the maris otter i still noticed some grains that weren't crushed enough to let water in to convert the starches. I was afraid to go much tighter then that. Any thoughts?

Anthony


Hmm - just curious, but is the "initial runoff gravity" the only thing you are using to measure full conversion? In my opinion that's not a very reliable measurement. Pre-boil gravity (after you hit your pre-boil volume) would be a better measurement, and post-boil gravity (on a dialed in system that you know) would be equally good if not a little better.

kal wrote:
A higher water to grist ratio results in a more fermentable wort. Beers that I want to maximize attenuation, I will use a higher water to grist ratio.


Do you think .25 qt/lb difference matters that much? This post got me interested in the idea, and I found Kai Troester's white paper on the topic, which led me to the conclusion that such a small change wouldn't make that large of a difference, but going up a full qt/lb might.

For reference: http://braukaiser.com/documents/Effects_of_mash_parameters_on_attenuation_and_efficiency.pdf
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bgural23



Joined: 15 Dec 2014
Posts: 2



PostLink    Posted: Mon Dec 15, 2014 10:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I would like to this as an extract brew sadly thats the only way i can at this time how long and at what temp would i steep the speacialty grains?
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kal
Forum Administrator


Joined: 12 Dec 2010
Posts: 8062
Location: Ottawa, Canada

Drinking: American Lager, Electric Hop Candy Jr, Scottish 70/-, German Pilsner, Russian Imperial Stout, Black Butte Porter, Saison, Kölsch

Working on: Kölsch, Janet's Brown Ale


PostLink    Posted: Mon Dec 15, 2014 8:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

bgural23 wrote:
I would like to this as an extract brew sadly thats the only way i can at this time how long and at what temp would i steep the speacialty grains?

No idea. Sorry. I have very little experience with extract, and when I did it was years ago.

Kal

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Last edited by kal on Mon Dec 15, 2014 10:14 pm; edited 1 time in total
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bgural23



Joined: 15 Dec 2014
Posts: 2



PostLink    Posted: Mon Dec 15, 2014 10:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for the response I guess I'll just wing it. This beer seems to be exactly what I've been looking for. After the holidays I'll be making the move from stove top extract to electric all grain with a lot of help from your site. Thanks
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Besk one



Joined: 01 Oct 2014
Posts: 26



PostLink    Posted: Tue Dec 23, 2014 12:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

https://scontent-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xap1/v/t1.0-9/9787_10152829442745219_8448730842260727822_n.jpg?oh=e16b9f875c0da96f6f5f7a7e375f1029&oe=5506FBBB

Just sampled a bottle after 2 weeks of conditioning at room temp.

This one's a winner, the wife loves the hop flavor and aroma. She's not a hop head so she was loving the clean and not bitter finish. The flavor is excellent and it's really drinkable.

I'm giving them a couple more days at room temp then they're going in the fridge for a few weeks before a big birthday / new years bbq.

Also this was my first ever brew! Jumped in with an all grain brew on a buddies equipment at his place. The xmas list this year has the starts of what will hopefully become my very own electric brewery Twisted Evil , will do gas fired until I can get all the pieces that are needed and will build it all out then.

Thanks Kal!
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kal
Forum Administrator


Joined: 12 Dec 2010
Posts: 8062
Location: Ottawa, Canada

Drinking: American Lager, Electric Hop Candy Jr, Scottish 70/-, German Pilsner, Russian Imperial Stout, Black Butte Porter, Saison, Kölsch

Working on: Kölsch, Janet's Brown Ale


PostLink    Posted: Tue Dec 23, 2014 5:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Glad you like it! Cool them down and let them clear up a bit in the fridge. I think you'll enjoy them even more.

Cheers,

Kal

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Geosmashing



Joined: 25 Apr 2014
Posts: 36
Location: Ottawa, Canada


PostLink    Posted: Tue Feb 10, 2015 4:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Would there be a huge difference if I subbed Wayermann Pils for the OiO 2-row?
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kal
Forum Administrator


Joined: 12 Dec 2010
Posts: 8062
Location: Ottawa, Canada

Drinking: American Lager, Electric Hop Candy Jr, Scottish 70/-, German Pilsner, Russian Imperial Stout, Black Butte Porter, Saison, Kölsch

Working on: Kölsch, Janet's Brown Ale


PostLink    Posted: Tue Feb 10, 2015 5:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

On this beer? Nope. Weyermann pils is a bit grainier tasting but you're not going to notice it on a beer like this with some crystal and lots of hops.

Where you will notice it most is a light lager or similar where there's 100% base malt and light hopping.

Kal

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Geosmashing



Joined: 25 Apr 2014
Posts: 36
Location: Ottawa, Canada


PostLink    Posted: Tue Feb 10, 2015 5:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Excellent, thanks for the reply Kal.

Gonna brew this up on Saturday, it'll be my second batch on the new electric rig.
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Guzzler



Joined: 18 Nov 2014
Posts: 30
Location: Minnesota


PostLink    Posted: Sun Apr 12, 2015 11:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

This beer is awesome! Everyone that has tasted it just raves about how good it is.
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kal
Forum Administrator


Joined: 12 Dec 2010
Posts: 8062
Location: Ottawa, Canada

Drinking: American Lager, Electric Hop Candy Jr, Scottish 70/-, German Pilsner, Russian Imperial Stout, Black Butte Porter, Saison, Kölsch

Working on: Kölsch, Janet's Brown Ale


PostLink    Posted: Mon Apr 13, 2015 12:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Glad you like it! It's one of the favourites around my house as well.

Kal

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busted knuckle



Joined: 28 Feb 2011
Posts: 29
Location: Denver, CO


PostLink    Posted: Wed May 13, 2015 4:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

This beer is on deck for me. I will be brewing this beer this weekend. Sounds like a good one!
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RodrigoEick



Joined: 17 Jul 2015
Posts: 2



PostLink    Posted: Fri Jul 17, 2015 8:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just kegged this recipe yesterday. Its really good!

Congratulations and thanks for sharing! Mug
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idingle



Joined: 20 Nov 2014
Posts: 26
Location: Alberta


PostLink    Posted: Wed Feb 24, 2016 6:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Brewed this Monday - fermenting buckets are bubbling happily. Now I am over-researching the next step as I do. Smile

Still learning so the questions are:

1. The dry hopping should happen once my gravities are constant several days in a row?(anticipated time 7-10days)
2. The FG is what I've measured prior to dry hopping?

Thanks Kal et al
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kal
Forum Administrator


Joined: 12 Dec 2010
Posts: 8062
Location: Ottawa, Canada

Drinking: American Lager, Electric Hop Candy Jr, Scottish 70/-, German Pilsner, Russian Imperial Stout, Black Butte Porter, Saison, Kölsch

Working on: Kölsch, Janet's Brown Ale


PostLink    Posted: Wed Feb 24, 2016 9:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

idingle wrote:
1. The dry hopping should happen once my gravities are constant several days in a row?(anticipated time 7-10days)

I usually wait until fermentation's nearly done. So around 1.015-1.020 or so, when the target's to be 1.012 (for example). I then leave it another week at ~70F.

The idea being that after that extra week fermentation's 100% done.

But that's just me.

Fermentation can scrub away some hop goodness, or change the dryhopping profile somewhat. Some will say, "don't do that". Others will say "it tastes a bit different and I prefer it". I suggest you try both ways, see what you like.

Like many things about brewing there are no right or wrong answer here.

While you should follow gravity and not time, my schedule for this beer that typically takes 1 week to get to the point where I want to add dry hops. Then I dry hop for an extra ~7 days. All in the primary. Then rack to my 5 gallon glass carboys and add gelatine for ~2 days to clarify, then keg.

If you underpitch or ferment too cold, or use old yeast, it may take longer / behave differently.

Quote:
2. The FG is what I've measured prior to dry hopping?


No, not necessarily. Final Gravity (FG) is the final measured gravity of the beer, when it's left to finish and all done, before it's packaged. It's the lowest it will go. Beer should never be packaged or racked if the gravity is still dropping. Let it finish and hit FG. Usually if the gravity hasn't changed for ~3 days you're likely at FG. If you have any doubts, leave it a week.

If you were to take a bottle of beer, pour it out, warm it up to room temp, degass it, and measure the gravity, that would be the final gravity.

Kal

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Last edited by kal on Tue Apr 19, 2016 3:51 am; edited 1 time in total
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idingle



Joined: 20 Nov 2014
Posts: 26
Location: Alberta


PostLink    Posted: Mon Feb 29, 2016 10:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Brewed this as my first brew(since bottling garbage in university) and hit an OG Of 1.050. Today checked and found it at 1.008, tasted and dry hopped.

How do people feel about "rousing the hops" through the dry hop? I used pellet Citra. Thanks!
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