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kal Forum Administrator
Joined: 12 Dec 2010 Posts: 11120 Location: Ottawa, Canada
Drinking: Pub Ale, Electric Creamsicle, Mild, Pliny the Younger, Belgian Dark Strong, Weizen, Russian Imperial Stout, Black Butte Porter
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Link Posted: Fri Mar 11, 2011 3:38 pm Post subject: What would you like to see in Control Panel kits? |
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Hi everyone!
We're looking for opinions on exactly what services to offer with the control panel kits. These are kits where the customer would basically get all of the parts they need in one package and built it themselves. The obvious advantages to ordering our kit instead of sourcing your own parts are:
- All the parts are the correct parts.
- All the parts have been pre-tested by us.
- Reduced shipping cost as you're buying from one supplier instead of 10-20.
The question we have is how much (if any) of the work should be pre-done. I see the following as possibilities:
(1) No pre-work done at all.
(2) All enclosure holes professionally milled (cut).
(3) All enclosure holes professionally milled (cut), enclosure cable plate sealed/sanded.
(4) All enclosure holes professionally milled (cut), enclosure cable plate sealed/sanded, enclosure primed & painted charcoal grey.
(5) All enclosure holes professionally milled (cut), enclosure cable plate sealed/sanded, enclosure primed & painted charcoal grey, heat sink tapped/installed/sealed, wires soldered to XLR connectors, volt/amp meter cables ready to install (no splicing/soldering required), some screws cut shorter for handles and front plate logo. Customer only has to mount the parts, wire, and seal some of the components. Only tools needed are a screwdriver, wire cutter/stripper/crimper.
(6) And for sake of completeness: A completely built tested, and programmed control panel. (This will of course be offered)
The more pre-work that we do, the less work the customer has to do and the less tools they need to provide, but the higher the resultant cost to the customer. Some of this is offset of course by not having to supply tools like a soldering iron, a tap&die set, punches, etc.
I’m thinking that offering (1) and possibly (5) would make sense but am curious what you all think. Of course, this may be hard to answer without pricing but if you have an opinion, please let us know!
Note: We're not too far away from offering up completely built and ready to go control panels - just a few more things to iron out!
Thanks!
Kal
_________________ Our new shop with over 150 new products: shop.TheElectricBrewery.com
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My basement/bar/brewery build 2.0
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sjch
Joined: 16 Dec 2010 Posts: 46 Location: Norway
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Link Posted: Fri Mar 11, 2011 4:43 pm Post subject: |
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(I wont be buying it because I am already building it myself, but if I would start again...)
I would be very disappointed if there would not be something in between (1) and (5).
Especially I would prefer (2) much over (1).
Soldering irons are more easy to come buy than CNC or any other type of mill. Having the holes readily cut and nicely aligned is very worth some cost in my opinion(within reason ) because its not something I could get done professionally myself.
Sanding, painting, soldering etc... even if I would not be able, there's always someone around who are.
so, I would buy a (2) if I hadnt built anything yet.
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Enggboy
Joined: 25 Jan 2011 Posts: 7 Location: Edmonton, AB
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Link Posted: Fri Mar 11, 2011 5:23 pm Post subject: |
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Personally, even though I am a few years away from affording this in the slightest, my personal preference would be to have option (2) offered as well as option (5).
The milling is a very tedius portion, and the tool purchase can be significant, so having that pre-done would be fantastic. I am a DIY'er at heart, but I know my limits, and without a healthy tool budget, I would not get the results that I wanted.
That's my 2 cents, but in reality it can be ignored seeing as I am in no way, shape for form able to actually spend two cents on brewing gear right now.
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kal Forum Administrator
Joined: 12 Dec 2010 Posts: 11120 Location: Ottawa, Canada
Drinking: Pub Ale, Electric Creamsicle, Mild, Pliny the Younger, Belgian Dark Strong, Weizen, Russian Imperial Stout, Black Butte Porter
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Link Posted: Fri Mar 11, 2011 5:51 pm Post subject: |
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Thanks guys - whether you're actually going to be buying or not is not important. It's the opinions that count.
You're absolutely right that offering a milled (cut) enclosure would be beneficial. We're also thinking of offering up *just* the milled panel for those people who want to source their own parts. Milling (cutting holes in) the panel by hand is labour intensive and if not done carefully results in components that are not ligned up perfectly.
I would have certainly paid extra if a nicely milled enclosure had been available!
Kal
_________________ Our new shop with over 150 new products: shop.TheElectricBrewery.com
We ship worldwide and support our products and customers for life.
Purchasing through our affiliate links helps support our site at no extra cost to you. We thank you!
My basement/bar/brewery build 2.0
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Thirteen
Joined: 06 Mar 2011 Posts: 4 Location: Bowmanville ON
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Link Posted: Fri Mar 11, 2011 6:09 pm Post subject: |
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Have you not been able to source a junction box without a removable cable plate? Most of the ones I see have bulky handles or are secured with clips so I still prefer your route from an esthetic perspective. This is the one aspect of the build that seems less than professional. Such care is taken with everything else that this one aspect seems DIY (especially when selling a completed panel).
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kal Forum Administrator
Joined: 12 Dec 2010 Posts: 11120 Location: Ottawa, Canada
Drinking: Pub Ale, Electric Creamsicle, Mild, Pliny the Younger, Belgian Dark Strong, Weizen, Russian Imperial Stout, Black Butte Porter
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Link Posted: Fri Mar 11, 2011 7:31 pm Post subject: |
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Thirteen wrote: | Have you not been able to source a junction box without a removable cable plate? |
We have not, at least not ones that don't cost an arm and a leg.
Quote: | Most of the ones I see have bulky handles or are secured with clips so I still prefer your route from an esthetic perspective. This is the one aspect of the build that seems less than professional. Such care is taken with everything else that this one aspect seems DIY (especially when selling a completed panel). |
Once painted it's not even noticeable and is extremely strong (as strong or stronger than the metal box itself). It would be great to find a simpler box though that is exactly the same size.
Kal
_________________ Our new shop with over 150 new products: shop.TheElectricBrewery.com
We ship worldwide and support our products and customers for life.
Purchasing through our affiliate links helps support our site at no extra cost to you. We thank you!
My basement/bar/brewery build 2.0
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crush
Joined: 28 Dec 2010 Posts: 706 Location: Telemark, Norway
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Link Posted: Fri Mar 11, 2011 8:17 pm Post subject: |
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for me, having the enclosure professionally milled would remove the biggest hurdle, and the one where any mistakes cannot be easily covered up. sorting out the cable plate would also be useful, especially for overseas customers, since I'm not sure jbweld is available outside the states? (It's just good luck that I have some left over from a previous project.)
I'm sure some will also prefer not to have to paint the enclosure, especially people without a garage or a work area. Metal hammered paint was difficult to source over here.
For international customers, I imagine the shipping costs will be quite high for the panel enclosure alone, and so if I were buying, I'd be happy to put more money into pre-build services to help balance out cost vs shipping.
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rosenjm
Joined: 21 Dec 2010 Posts: 249 Location: Ballston Spa, NY
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Link Posted: Fri Mar 11, 2011 8:18 pm Post subject: |
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I would have to agree that options 2 and 5 would be the most popular. I would almost say that option 3 might be a better route that 2 depending on the cost difference. I would be willing to pay an extra $10-20 to have the enclosure complete and ready to go and not have to worry about sealing the top plate. That process still requires some sort of grinding equipment than many people don't have.
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crush
Joined: 28 Dec 2010 Posts: 706 Location: Telemark, Norway
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Link Posted: Sat Mar 12, 2011 12:27 am Post subject: |
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You need grinding equipment? I thought Kal said to file down the screws in the instructions.
_________________ ...just one more.
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Spike Innovations TheElectricBrewery.com manufacturer
Joined: 26 Feb 2011 Posts: 245 Location: ME
Working on: Your Brewery!
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Link Posted: Sat Mar 12, 2011 2:08 am Post subject: |
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crush wrote: | You need grinding equipment? I thought Kal said to file down the screws in the instructions. |
I'm sure you could file them down if they were pretty short to begin with. It would be a pretty tedious and daunting task however.
I used a 90 degree mini die grinder that has a sanding disc attachment. Allowed me to make quick work of all the screws and flatten the JB Weld as well. I had this from previous work but it was just a cheap one from Home Depot.
Mike
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crush
Joined: 28 Dec 2010 Posts: 706 Location: Telemark, Norway
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Link Posted: Sat Mar 12, 2011 2:19 am Post subject: |
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Thanks for the info Spike! Unfortunately, there's no home depot in Norway. The closest is a dremel, I'd imagine. I think I can get a mini grinding wheel for that.
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Spike Innovations TheElectricBrewery.com manufacturer
Joined: 26 Feb 2011 Posts: 245 Location: ME
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busted knuckle
Joined: 28 Feb 2011 Posts: 27 Location: Denver, CO
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Link Posted: Thu Mar 31, 2011 2:56 pm Post subject: |
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Kal,
Did you decide on a what kind of DIY kit you will be offering?
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kal Forum Administrator
Joined: 12 Dec 2010 Posts: 11120 Location: Ottawa, Canada
Drinking: Pub Ale, Electric Creamsicle, Mild, Pliny the Younger, Belgian Dark Strong, Weizen, Russian Imperial Stout, Black Butte Porter
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busted knuckle
Joined: 28 Feb 2011 Posts: 27 Location: Denver, CO
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Link Posted: Thu Mar 31, 2011 4:54 pm Post subject: |
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I guess I'll just wait patiently.
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kal Forum Administrator
Joined: 12 Dec 2010 Posts: 11120 Location: Ottawa, Canada
Drinking: Pub Ale, Electric Creamsicle, Mild, Pliny the Younger, Belgian Dark Strong, Weizen, Russian Imperial Stout, Black Butte Porter
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Grandequeso
Joined: 17 Mar 2011 Posts: 36 Location: Jacksonville, Fl
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Link Posted: Fri Apr 01, 2011 3:37 am Post subject: |
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I know you are still working things out with just getting this launched. But heres my suggestions for the future. I think it would open doors to a lot more folks if you made different versions available. I know you say you built / designed your system with cost not being a very influencial factor, but for many people cost is a unavoidable factor. You might be able to offer say a "econo" version that didn't have volt meter, amp meter, pump controls, omega timer....ect. Heck you could even have a super bare bones single PID version that had a selector switch that went to different probes.... Still offer all the same saftly of course but less bells and whistles. Then offer upgrade kits from economy to deluxe. Anyhow just some ideas I had for the future that could open your product to more people. Thank you so much for putting this site together, I would of never been inspired to build my brewery if I hadn't stumbled upon your site.
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kal Forum Administrator
Joined: 12 Dec 2010 Posts: 11120 Location: Ottawa, Canada
Drinking: Pub Ale, Electric Creamsicle, Mild, Pliny the Younger, Belgian Dark Strong, Weizen, Russian Imperial Stout, Black Butte Porter
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rgrrbt
Joined: 08 Jan 2011 Posts: 13
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Link Posted: Wed Apr 06, 2011 2:24 pm Post subject: |
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I would like to see a transformer/rectifier/volt and amp meter/shunt offered separately. Given the variable control rectifiers have only been available from overseas vendors, it would be nice to have this package offered.
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KES
Joined: 13 May 2011 Posts: 472 Location: Iowa
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Link Posted: Thu May 19, 2011 9:45 pm Post subject: |
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My 2 cents, (1st post), I would be VERY interested in a pre-cut enclosure. Just to avoid the tool purchase alone! I have been monitoring Ebay for Kal's 16x16x8 model. No luck at all. A 20x20x8 from the listed supplier has gone from $100 to $140 Ebay item # 130305269860 in the last couple of months! WOW! Can you say, "price gouge!" Sign me up for option #3.
_________________ “Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy.” B. Franklin
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