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Pippicidal
Joined: 07 Jan 2019 Posts: 6 Location: Baja Sur
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Link Posted: Tue Jan 29, 2019 3:44 pm Post subject: Kettle Size |
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What's the smallest batch you could make with 50 gallon Blichmann kettles as an ElectricBrewery style setup? I ask because I would like to be able to do 12 gallon 'pilot' batches and 1 bbl standard batches in the same kettles if possible. I assume one of the limiting factors would be grain bed depth. Thanks for your feedback.
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kal Forum Administrator
Joined: 12 Dec 2010 Posts: 11116 Location: Ottawa, Canada
Drinking: Pub Ale, Electric Creamsicle, Mild, Pliny the Younger, Belgian Dark Strong, Weizen, Russian Imperial Stout, Black Butte Porter
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Pippicidal
Joined: 07 Jan 2019 Posts: 6 Location: Baja Sur
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Link Posted: Tue Jan 29, 2019 4:25 pm Post subject: |
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Thanks for the quick reply Kal. I'd like to do a virtual clone of your setup (except for maybe a plate chiller instead) so the Hop Stopper would be part of the setup as would two heating elements per kettle. If only using the lower heating element in a 50 gallon kettle with the HS below what do you think the smallest batch would be?
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kal Forum Administrator
Joined: 12 Dec 2010 Posts: 11116 Location: Ottawa, Canada
Drinking: Pub Ale, Electric Creamsicle, Mild, Pliny the Younger, Belgian Dark Strong, Weizen, Russian Imperial Stout, Black Butte Porter
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Pippicidal
Joined: 07 Jan 2019 Posts: 6 Location: Baja Sur
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Link Posted: Tue Jan 29, 2019 7:20 pm Post subject: |
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OK, so based on the Blichmann site the 55 gallon kettle (G-2) has a circumference of 23.6 inches.
23.6 inches at 3.5 inches height is 1531 cubic inches. @ 231 cubic inches/gallon = 6.6 gallons. That get's me to the bottom of the element right? What do you think the measurement to the top of the element would be with the XL Hop Stopper etc?
TIA
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kal Forum Administrator
Joined: 12 Dec 2010 Posts: 11116 Location: Ottawa, Canada
Drinking: Pub Ale, Electric Creamsicle, Mild, Pliny the Younger, Belgian Dark Strong, Weizen, Russian Imperial Stout, Black Butte Porter
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Link Posted: Tue Jan 29, 2019 8:00 pm Post subject: |
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The element is here:
https://shop.theelectricbrewery.com/collections/heating-elements/products/heating-element-kit-pre-assembled
Looks like this:
The 4 heating element rods are about an inch thick or so when bundled this way. I say "about" as there's flexibility here. These are not machined to be a precise size (because they don't have to be).
In a 55 gallon kettle I'm not sure if you need to install the Hop Stopper XL underneath the element, or if there's enough room to put the element off to the side and lower a bit. You'd have to test this. That said, you can't install the center of the element much lower than 3" anyway since the heating element box will otherwise be lower than the kettle bottom.
So in the worst case scenario, assuming the heating element rod bundles are about 1" high and that you have to have the hop stopper underneath which needs 3" clearance, you'd be installing the heating element hole about 3.5" up the side to leave 3" free underneath for the hop stopper. While the heating element can touch the element, leaving a bit of room would probably make it easier to get the hop stopper in and out, so a hole 4" up is probably better. But again, wait until you have everything and dry fit before punching any holes.
All this is somewhat moot however given that the wort volume with the kettle filled to 3.5" comes up as only 6.6 gallons, nowhere near the 12 gallons you want to make. That means that you'd need to fill to almost 6.4" to reach 12 gallons. So I don't see any need to be overly precise here with any measuring here. What you want to do would appear to work without any concerns.
I always tell people too: If the worst case is that you have to make an extra gallon or two than the minimum you want to make occasionally, do that and just dump it if you have to. It's only a extra few dollars. It's usually not worth making a bunch of sacrifices (time/money) to keep the minimum batch size very small. For example, I've seen some have a completely separate smaller second boil kettle just for smaller batches. But the cost involved in doing that and the hassles of storing it and swapping between kettles doesn't make sense to me. You'd have to make many hundreds of smaller batches for this to even pay off as compared to just making a gallon or two more on the bigger kettle and then dumping some wort.
Good luck!
Kal
_________________ Our new shop with over 150 new products: shop.TheElectricBrewery.com
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My basement/bar/brewery build 2.0
Last edited by kal on Tue Jan 29, 2019 8:07 pm; edited 2 times in total
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kal Forum Administrator
Joined: 12 Dec 2010 Posts: 11116 Location: Ottawa, Canada
Drinking: Pub Ale, Electric Creamsicle, Mild, Pliny the Younger, Belgian Dark Strong, Weizen, Russian Imperial Stout, Black Butte Porter
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Pippicidal
Joined: 07 Jan 2019 Posts: 6 Location: Baja Sur
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Link Posted: Tue Jan 29, 2019 8:36 pm Post subject: |
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Excellent reasoning. Thanks much Kal. I originally thought I would need a set of 20 gallon kettles and the 55s.
Another question. With the 50A control panel for 30+ gallon batches have you had clients use these for 2 bbl setups (IE the Blich 55s with the extensions)? Is there enough heating/power to efficiently boil that amount of wort?
Cheers
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kal Forum Administrator
Joined: 12 Dec 2010 Posts: 11116 Location: Ottawa, Canada
Drinking: Pub Ale, Electric Creamsicle, Mild, Pliny the Younger, Belgian Dark Strong, Weizen, Russian Imperial Stout, Black Butte Porter
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Pippicidal
Joined: 07 Jan 2019 Posts: 6 Location: Baja Sur
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Link Posted: Wed Jan 30, 2019 10:00 pm Post subject: |
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Thanks Kal
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kal Forum Administrator
Joined: 12 Dec 2010 Posts: 11116 Location: Ottawa, Canada
Drinking: Pub Ale, Electric Creamsicle, Mild, Pliny the Younger, Belgian Dark Strong, Weizen, Russian Imperial Stout, Black Butte Porter
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kal Forum Administrator
Joined: 12 Dec 2010 Posts: 11116 Location: Ottawa, Canada
Drinking: Pub Ale, Electric Creamsicle, Mild, Pliny the Younger, Belgian Dark Strong, Weizen, Russian Imperial Stout, Black Butte Porter
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Link Posted: Sat Feb 02, 2019 10:09 pm Post subject: |
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Forgot to mention:
While I think that our 50A Electric Brewery Control panel for 30+ gallons works well for a 2 bbl setup, sometimes people want to save time and heat faster.
To heat faster, a larger power control panel to drive more heating elements would be required. At this time custom orders such as this are simply not possible as we need to focus on our core products. You may of course use the links on our website to order some of the parts you need and build your own custom control panel based on our design if you like. Keep in mind that parts rated for more than 50A are considerably more expensive and harder to find as they are specialized (not standardized). For example, there is no NEMA standard for plugs/receptacles above 50A. So a control panel above 50A typically need to be hard-wired which itself introduces complexities and other concerns such as electrical permitting as now the control panel becomes part of the building wiring.
If you do decide you need more power for a substantially larger setup and/or faster heat times, one option that many brewers use is to use our 50A control panel to maintain hot liquor temperature and boil, but temporarily add extra power with one or two separate 5500W heating elements on a separate 30-50A circuit. All that is required is one or two 30A outlets and a breaker box located near the kettles to turn them on and off. Any electrician can wire this up. These breakers control the separate elements with the breaker box and turn them on to heat up the hot liquor tank water faster or to get to boil faster. Once close to target temperature, they're turned off and then the heating elements driven by our 50A control panel are used to maintain temperature/boil. While maybe not as elegant, this is a more cost effective solution than building one massive control panel to handle more than 50A of power.
We have also been working on is a 'booster' panel to control the other two extra elements in a more elegant manner if you're interested in such a product. We're currently taking orders privately if you are interested. It's a smaller, simplified panel with no PIDs, simple ON/OFF switches for controlling up to two additional elements manually. Depending on batch size, these either stay on throughout the whole brewing process if dealing with much larger batch sizes, or are turned on during ramp periods where faster heating is required. The main panel would handle maintaining temps and boil intensity. This booster box would require its own separate 50A GFCI circuit (200 - 240V AC). Let us know if interested.
To order our other standard products see here: https://shop.theelectricbrewery.com/
Cheers!
Kal
_________________ Our new shop with over 150 new products: shop.TheElectricBrewery.com
We ship worldwide and support our products and customers for life.
Purchasing through our affiliate links helps support our site at no extra cost to you. We thank you!
My basement/bar/brewery build 2.0
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