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Metal vs plastic ducting

 
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d2024p



Joined: 25 Oct 2018
Posts: 3



PostLink    Posted: Thu Oct 25, 2018 2:32 pm    Post subject: Metal vs plastic ducting Reply with quote


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Hello,

First I want to say the TEB is incredible. I have used it as a resource to plan the extractor system for a new brewery. This is going to be a glass and steel home office design which will house a 100l setup. The unit is already in place and I am excited about getting the extractor system set up so I can start using it!

There is one thing I wanted to clear up and I really hope someone might be able to help. The ventilation guide on the website says to only use metal ducting, and I have been trying hard to stick to this. The problem is that stainless is really expensive. I have to buy three metres (9ft) from any of the small number of UK suppliers that stock stainless over galvanized. Because I just need to drill a hole anywhere in the steel shell for the outward vent I can get away with a very short duct run, (2-3 feet max) so I would be wasting at least six feet of duct.

I am not sure I want to go for galvanized steel because I am worried about corrosion and food safety. I may want to go semi-commercial in the future and don't want to have to replace the ductwork to conform. I want a stainless hood and I know where to get one reasonably cheap, but I am worried that even with a condensation trap I will get some tainted condensate coming back from the galvanized duct.

So.. I was wondering why the guide on the website says not to use plastic. Can anyone shed any light? Apart from the fact that steel looks cool Smile Plastic would have advantages for me such as price, availability of 1m lengths, self-insulation and the fact that it's easy to work with. Can anyone shed any light please? Any assistance would be gratefully appreciated.

If I were to get plastic just to get the vent through the 'wall' cavity, does anyone know if I can join six inch plastic to six inch steel? Or does it have to be 100% one way or another?

Cheers!
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kal
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Joined: 12 Dec 2010
Posts: 9933
Location: Ottawa, Canada

Drinking: German Lager, Electric Hop Candy Jr, Scottish 70/-, Cali Common, Maibock, Helles, Russian Imperial Stout, Black Butte Porter

Working on: Weizen


PostLink    Posted: Thu Oct 25, 2018 2:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Welcome to the forum!

Solid plastic is fine (like PVC rated for this sort of stuff). I wouldn't use flexible plastic ducts.

I.e.

This is fine: https://www.homedepot.com/p/6-in-x-10-ft-PVC-Sch-40-DWV-Plain-End-Pipe-30577/203308683

This is the sort of stuff I recommend against: https://www.toolstation.com/shop/Ventilation+%26+Heating/d290/Fans/sd280/PVC+Flexible+Ducting+Hose/p32740

Now that said, the wording in the instructions isn't 100% clear. I'll update. Thanks for pointing this out!

Kal

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kal
Forum Administrator


Joined: 12 Dec 2010
Posts: 9933
Location: Ottawa, Canada

Drinking: German Lager, Electric Hop Candy Jr, Scottish 70/-, Cali Common, Maibock, Helles, Russian Imperial Stout, Black Butte Porter

Working on: Weizen


PostLink    Posted: Thu Oct 25, 2018 3:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Instructions (and ebook) updated:

http://www.theelectricbrewery.com/ventilation?page=6

The most pertinent part:



Note: There's absolutely no reason to use stainless here. Galvanized steel is fine, as is PVC rated for this. PVC is more expensive. One benefit of PVC is if the seams are properly cemented together, you don't need to tape the seams.

Cheers!

Kal

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Purchasing through our affiliate links helps support our site at no extra cost to you. We thank you!
My basement/bar/brewery build 2.0


Last edited by kal on Thu Oct 25, 2018 3:21 pm; edited 1 time in total
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d2024p



Joined: 25 Oct 2018
Posts: 3



PostLink    Posted: Thu Oct 25, 2018 3:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Kal,

That's really good of you, thanks so much. I was kind of looking forward to some professional looking stainless but I just can't justify the cost, not at the moment. I just need to keep telling myself that it's a working unit and it is build for functionality and practicality! So PVC-rated plastic will do just fine at a fraction of the cost.

I completely understand why flexible ducting would be ill-advised at best and downright disastrous at worst. The impact that it would have on suction and with a 5kwh of wort vapor going through during a boil I can see it getting absolutely saturated and, let's face it, staying that way.

Whilst I am typing I have remembered one related but separate question, if that's OK. I am getting an in-line centrifugal fan like the one you recommend but due to the length of the duct run I might need to install it on the vertical axis, so that the blades are horizontal. Yours is the opposite (for good reason, in your case). Do you see a problem with 'opposite' approach?

Keep up the good work and if there is any way I can contribute to the site please let me know.

Cheers!
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kal
Forum Administrator


Joined: 12 Dec 2010
Posts: 9933
Location: Ottawa, Canada

Drinking: German Lager, Electric Hop Candy Jr, Scottish 70/-, Cali Common, Maibock, Helles, Russian Imperial Stout, Black Butte Porter

Working on: Weizen


PostLink    Posted: Thu Oct 25, 2018 3:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

d2024p wrote:
Whilst I am typing I have remembered one related but separate question, if that's OK. I am getting an in-line centrifugal fan like the one you recommend but due to the length of the duct run I might need to install it on the vertical axis, so that the blades are horizontal. Yours is the opposite (for good reason, in your case). Do you see a problem with 'opposite' approach?

The biggest issue is that some condensation will likely form, and with my placement as mentioned in the instructions I allow for a drip hole to let this moisture escape in a controlled manner. If you install it vertically (up/down) instead of horizontally (left/right) I'm not sure where this condensation will end up.

Insulating the duct will minimize condensation as it'll keep the steam hot, but it all depends on the run length, ambient temp, and so forth.

My run is short (probably around 6 feet or so) not insulated, and i get about half a cup of water that drips out of the fan over a 60 min boil.

Quote:
Keep up the good work and if there is any way I can contribute to the site please let me know.

Thanks for kind words! Lots of ways to contribute!:

(1) Buy something from our shop: https://shop.theelectricbrewery.com/
(2) Buy something from our affiliates: http://www.theelectricbrewery.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=24489
(3) Sign up for a club membership: http://www.theelectricbrewery.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=24536

Cheers!

Kal

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d2024p



Joined: 25 Oct 2018
Posts: 3



PostLink    Posted: Thu Oct 25, 2018 4:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

kal wrote:
The biggest issue is that some condensation will likely form, and with my placement as mentioned in the instructions I allow for a drip hole to let this moisture escape in a controlled manner. If you install it vertically (up/down) instead of horizontally (left/right) I'm not sure where this condensation will end up.

Insulating the duct will minimize condensation as it'll keep the steam hot, but it all depends on the run length, ambient temp, and so forth.

My run is short (probably around 6 feet or so) not insulated, and i get about half a cup of water that drips out of the fan over a 60 min boil.

Kal


Thanks Kal! My run will be so short that I don't expect there to be much at all, so I'm hoping that one of these where the duct meets the extractor hood (allowing me to neatly run the condensation out in a pipe running along the hood) will do the trick.

https://www.amazon.co.uk/condensation-diameter-hydroponics-ventilation-extractor/dp/B00BW31SA0/ref=as_li_ss_tl?ie=UTF8&linkCode=ll1&tag=curpalcrtproa-21&linkId=74915f09025aa50568ed02fe12511959&language=en_GB

I'll sign up for a year's membership, it's the least I can do given all the advice your site gave me!
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kal
Forum Administrator


Joined: 12 Dec 2010
Posts: 9933
Location: Ottawa, Canada

Drinking: German Lager, Electric Hop Candy Jr, Scottish 70/-, Cali Common, Maibock, Helles, Russian Imperial Stout, Black Butte Porter

Working on: Weizen


PostLink    Posted: Thu Oct 25, 2018 5:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sounds like a plan! As long as the ducts are angled properly such that any condensation runs in the right direction you're good.

Thanks for signing up!

Kal

P.S. I also changed your Amazon link to support our forum/site. Wink

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Our new shop with over 150 new products: shop.TheElectricBrewery.com
Purchasing through our affiliate links helps support our site at no extra cost to you. We thank you!
My basement/bar/brewery build 2.0
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