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CTBBrewing




Joined: 23 Oct 2018
Posts: 2



PostLink    Posted: Tue Oct 23, 2018 12:07 pm    Post subject: Moar Powr! Reply with quote


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I am looking at a 3bbl tank system that uses 2 x 20kw elements and 2 x 6kw elements. Can the 30+ panel be adapted to that wattage and amperage? If so, can that be pre-assembled?
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kal
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Joined: 12 Dec 2010
Posts: 11116
Location: Ottawa, Canada

Drinking: Pub Ale, Electric Creamsicle, Mild, Pliny the Younger, Belgian Dark Strong, Weizen, Russian Imperial Stout, Black Butte Porter


PostLink    Posted: Tue Oct 23, 2018 1:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi and welcome to the forum!

How were you considering splitting that 52kw of power up? (How much per kettle?)

Our largest 50A Electric Brewery Control Panel for 30+ gallons can handle up to about 11000 watts of power, enough to effectively boil 2-3 bbl (31-93 gallons) and possibly more depending on kettle configuration/insulation, ambient temperature, use of a kettle chimney, etc. For some examples, take a look at our testimonials page where we show some running this panel on various sized setups up to and including 3.5 bbl. See: http://www.theelectricbrewery.com/testimonials

This would normally be 2 x 5500W in the HLT and 2 x 5500W in the boil. Only one kettle can be run at once. 11000W of power uses 45.8A of power (11000/240). Add two pumps and some minor pull from the electronics in the panel and you're just under the 50A limit.

11000W of power would heat 3 bbl (93 gallons) at a rate of 0.77 degrees per minute, and 2 bbl (62 gallons) at a rate of 1.15 degrees per minute.

To heat faster, a larger power control panel to drive more heating elements would be required. At this time custom orders such as this are simply not possible as we need to focus on our core products. You may of course use the links on our website to order some of the parts you need and build your own custom control panel based on our design if you like. Keep in mind that parts rated for more than 50A are considerably more expensive and harder to find as they are specialized (not standardized). For example, there is no NEMA standard for plugs/receptacles above 50A. So a control panel above 50A typically need to be hard-wired which itself introduces complexities and other concerns such as electrical permitting as now the control panel becomes part of the building wiring.

If you do decide you need more power for a substantially larger setup, one option that many brewers use is to use our 50A control panel to maintain hot liquor temperature and boil, but temporarily add extra power with one or two separate 5500W heating elements on a separate 30-50A circuit. All that is required is one or two 30A outlets and a breaker box located near the kettles to turn them on and off. Any electrician can wire this up. These breakers control the separate elements with the breaker box and turn them on to heat up the hot liquor tank water faster or to get to boil faster. Once close to target temperature, they're turned off and then the heating elements driven by our 50A control panel are used to maintain temperature/boil. While maybe not as elegant, this is a more cost effective solution than building one massive control panel to handle more than 50A of power.

We have been working on is a 'booster' panel to control the other two extra elements in a more elegant manner too if you're interested in such a product. We'll be bringing it to market soon but are taking orders privately if you are interested (email me at kal@theelectricbrewery.com). It's a smaller, simplified panel with no PIDs, simple ON/OFF switches for controlling up to two additional elements manually. Depending on batch size, these either stay on throughout the whole brewing process if dealing with large batch sizes, or are turned on during ramp periods where faster heating is required. The main panel would handle maintaining temps and boil intensity. This booster box would require its own separate 50A GFCI circuit (200 - 240V AC). Let us know if interested.

To order our other standard products see here: https://shop.theelectricbrewery.com/

Good luck!

Kal

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CTBBrewing




Joined: 23 Oct 2018
Posts: 2



PostLink    Posted: Tue Oct 23, 2018 3:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks, Kal!

What I am looking at doing is a 20kw element in the HLT, a 20kw in the BK, a 6kw in the external HERMs tank, and a 6kw under the false bottom of the MLT.

I hadn't considered an external, manual, panel for booster elements. That's a great idea! Is it possible to (using your 50A control box) individually control the 4 booster elements? IOW, be able to add one in the HLT or BK instead of having to add both? Just thinking of power consumption and flexibility - have the ability to have a single in both the BK and HLT going at the same time.

I'm just starting to exp[lore this idea, so I'll have to give it more thought and I'm sure I'll have more questions. Thanks!
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kal
Forum Administrator



Joined: 12 Dec 2010
Posts: 11116
Location: Ottawa, Canada

Drinking: Pub Ale, Electric Creamsicle, Mild, Pliny the Younger, Belgian Dark Strong, Weizen, Russian Imperial Stout, Black Butte Porter


PostLink    Posted: Tue Oct 23, 2018 3:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi!

CTBBrewing wrote:
What I am looking at doing is a 20kw element in the HLT, a 20kw in the BK, a 6kw in the external HERMs tank, and a 6kw under the false bottom of the MLT.

What you're describing here is not something I've ever heard of someone doing. Can you explain a bit more how this is going to work? What's your process? For example, what do you mean by external HERMS tank? Why do you want an external HERMS tank? (What is the benefit?). Why do you want a 6KW element under the mash false bottom?

Normally 3-vessel HERMS setups have heat applied to the HLT and heat applied to the boil kettle. Nothing else is required. The mash temperature is maintained by continuously recirculating the sweet wort through the HERMS coil located in the HLT. You simply set your HLT to the mash temp and the mash follows Temp always goes up so this works very well. No need to separate.

Quote:
I hadn't considered an external, manual, panel for booster elements. That's a great idea! Is it possible to (using your 50A control box) individually control the 4 booster elements? IOW, be able to add one in the HLT or BK instead of having to add both?

The booster box controls 2 elements and they are individually controllable. You can put both in the HLT, both in the boil, or one in each.

They are separate from the 4 controlled by the 50A control panel for 30+ gallons outlined here: http://www.theelectricbrewery.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=24918

Keep in mind that we have many using our 50A control panel for 30+ gallons "as is" on setups up to 3.5 bbl in size.
Our 50A/30+ gallon control panel is here: https://shop.theelectricbrewery.com/collections/control-panels

Those that want faster ramp/heat times can add booster boxes to add 2 extra elements any way they like. You could use booster box to have 3 elements per kettle or 4/2, or 2/4. You could use two booster boxes to do 4/4 even. Completely up to you.

Kal

_________________
Our new shop with over 150 new products: shop.TheElectricBrewery.com
We ship worldwide and support our products and customers for life.
Purchasing through our affiliate links helps support our site at no extra cost to you. We thank you!
My basement/bar/brewery build 2.0
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View user's photo album (21 photos)
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