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Grain group purchase
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CHB



Joined: 17 Nov 2016
Posts: 6



PostLink    Posted: Sun May 13, 2018 5:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote


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KB wrote:
When a bag of pale malt is $27 and someone sells it for over $50 this is more than 100% markup. I understand people are in business to make money. However, I'm not paying for their vacations too. It's their job to take my money and it's my job to keep my money. A bit of a profit is fine.

Closest group grain purchase is in MD/DC. No fun with beltway traffic.

Instead of writing "There are several option in the NoVA region for fair priced grain." provide details.

Not sure where you're getting that a 50lb bag of malt is $27. Unless you're doing a huge volume, I don't know of any brewery in NoVA that's getting 50lb bags for $27. I think fair market value for hobby brewing at about $1 per pound for 2-row is perfectly reasonable and is proven out by the market. I personally get $0.92 per pound, but I get 250 pounds at a shot.

You come across as angry, and your attitude is not very friendly. It's not a surprise you're not getting much help with alternative ideas.

I assume you have a job and get paid vacation. Why would you begrudge someone else to take a paid vacation?

Either chill out and get that attitude out of your posts towards people who respond in good faith to help you, or just do us a favor and leave the forum.

Regards.
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kal
Forum Administrator


Joined: 12 Dec 2010
Posts: 9310
Location: Ottawa, Canada

Drinking: German Lager, Electric Hop Candy Jr, Scottish 70/-, English IPA, Russian Imperial Stout, Black Butte Porter, Saison

Working on: Kölsch


PostLink    Posted: Sun May 13, 2018 8:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Lets try and keep things friendly on both sides folks. Thank you!

@CHB: Please do not harass other forum members and/or ask them to leave to the forum. That's again the forum rules ( http://www.theelectricbrewery.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=24491 )

@KB: I think you need to reset your expectations. 100% markup for a perishable food product is not at all out of line. As someone who's been involved in large grain purchases I can tell you that you can indeed get that $27/sac pricing on some simple 2-row grain but only if you're willing to set up a commercial account with a distributor/maltster and spend upwards of $5-$10K per order. Your local LHBS is not getting that pricing as they can't move that much before it goes bad. Many breweries are not even getting that pricing as it's above the volumes even they are using. You seem to want large brewery pricing, at extremely low volumes, and want utmost convenience (not having to travel far for it). Not even one of these is feasible, and you want all three.

Kal

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CHB



Joined: 17 Nov 2016
Posts: 6



PostLink    Posted: Mon May 14, 2018 12:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

kal wrote:
Lets try and keep things friendly on both sides folks. Thank you!

@CHB: Please do not harass other forum members and/or ask them to leave to the forum. That's again the forum rules ( http://www.theelectricbrewery.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=24491 )

@KB: I think you need to reset your expectations. 100% markup for a perishable food product is not at all out of line. As someone who's been involved in large grain purchases I can tell you that you can indeed get that $27/sac pricing on some simple 2-row grain but only if you're willing to set up a commercial account with a distributor/maltster and spend upwards of $5-$10K per order. Your local LHBS is not getting that pricing as they can't move that much before it goes bad. Many breweries are not even getting that pricing as it's above the volumes even they are using. You seem to want large brewery pricing, at extremely low volumes, and want utmost convenience (not having to travel far for it). Not even one of these is feasible, and you want all three.

Kal

Sorry Kal ... my sincerest apologies. I offered to help and felt set upon. It's all about feelings these days. We all have bad days. Won't happen again.
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kal
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Joined: 12 Dec 2010
Posts: 9310
Location: Ottawa, Canada

Drinking: German Lager, Electric Hop Candy Jr, Scottish 70/-, English IPA, Russian Imperial Stout, Black Butte Porter, Saison

Working on: Kölsch


PostLink    Posted: Mon May 14, 2018 12:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

No worries at all. I completely understand! Cheers!

Kal

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dp Brewing Company



Joined: 08 Jul 2013
Posts: 549
Location: Midwest

Drinking: Belgian Waffle Strong Ale, Dry Barn Door #13, Bham Brown, White Shadow Stout, Rye Not Today

Working on: Maple Mead Barrel Aged


PostLink    Posted: Mon May 14, 2018 12:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've never seen a price as low as $27 per a bag (unless it was old stuff they were trying to get rid of). Plus you have to realize there are more cost associated with the grain than just the price per bag for the LHBS.

Cost you might not think about:

Pallet shipping to your shop ($100-200 per pallet divided by the amount of bags)
You have to store it somewhere which cost rent and utilities (These bags take up space)
Labor to sell the grain (If you're not a one man shop you will need to pay someone to run the counter)
Account for spoilage (I toss out lots of grains because I would rather pay for a new bag than sell someone old grain)

$50 is a fair price in my opinion.

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kwdriver



Joined: 19 Jan 2013
Posts: 105
Location: Alexandria, VA

Drinking: Kolsch, Munich Helles, Tripel, Black Butte Porter clone on nitro


PostLink    Posted: Mon May 14, 2018 7:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Although I live a little closer to DC than the original poster (just inside the beltway near Old Town Alexandria) I had a great experience recently doing a grain buy with the GRIST homebrew club and the DC club. Contacted the group buy organizer via email and was given permissions to go to a webpage and placing an online order for full bags and splits. About 3 weeks later the buy closed, everyone paid via Paypal and took the drive to 3 Stars Brewery in DC. Took a little time to separate the grains but nice overall experience and saved some $$$ on bulk grain. You can contact Tony the organizer at: dcareagroupgrainbuy@gmail.com for the info on the next buy if interested. Real nice folks and well organized.
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dp Brewing Company



Joined: 08 Jul 2013
Posts: 549
Location: Midwest

Drinking: Belgian Waffle Strong Ale, Dry Barn Door #13, Bham Brown, White Shadow Stout, Rye Not Today

Working on: Maple Mead Barrel Aged


PostLink    Posted: Tue May 15, 2018 12:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Speaking of group buys, I got an email from Northern Brewer wanting to know if my local homebrew club would like to do a bulk buy. I was surprised to get the email.
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KB



Joined: 06 Nov 2014
Posts: 173
Location: Manassas, VA

Drinking: Amber ale, Brown Ale, Endless Summer ale, Hazelnut Brown Ale, Peach Mead, Pear Hard Cider, Strawberry Blonde Ale

Working on: Pear ciders number 2 and 3


PostLink    Posted: Sun May 20, 2018 1:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

kwdriver wrote:
Although I live a little closer to DC than the original poster (just inside the beltway near Old Town Alexandria) I had a great experience recently doing a grain buy with the GRIST homebrew club and the DC club. Contacted the group buy organizer via email and was given permissions to go to a webpage and placing an online order for full bags and splits. About 3 weeks later the buy closed, everyone paid via Paypal and took the drive to 3 Stars Brewery in DC. Took a little time to separate the grains but nice overall experience and saved some $$$ on bulk grain. You can contact Tony the organizer at: dcareagroupgrainbuy@gmail.com for the info on the next buy if interested. Real nice folks and well organized.


I've participated in the 3 Stars Brewery group grain purchase. Isn't easy getting from my location to/from the DC/Maryland line (3 Stars Brewery) especially with traffic around here.
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KB



Joined: 06 Nov 2014
Posts: 173
Location: Manassas, VA

Drinking: Amber ale, Brown Ale, Endless Summer ale, Hazelnut Brown Ale, Peach Mead, Pear Hard Cider, Strawberry Blonde Ale

Working on: Pear ciders number 2 and 3


PostLink    Posted: Sun May 20, 2018 1:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

dp Brewing Company wrote:
Speaking of group buys, I got an email from Northern Brewer wanting to know if my local homebrew club would like to do a bulk buy. I was surprised to get the email.


I believe Northern Brewer is owned by InBev.
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kal
Forum Administrator


Joined: 12 Dec 2010
Posts: 9310
Location: Ottawa, Canada

Drinking: German Lager, Electric Hop Candy Jr, Scottish 70/-, English IPA, Russian Imperial Stout, Black Butte Porter, Saison

Working on: Kölsch


PostLink    Posted: Sun May 20, 2018 1:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

KB wrote:
I've participated in the 3 Stars Brewery group grain purchase. Isn't easy getting from my location to/from the DC/Maryland line (3 Stars Brewery) especially with traffic around here.

Group grain purchases like this one involve volunteers spending dozens of hours organizing for absolutely nothing in return. I've volunteered for past buys and it's a ton of organizing, splitting bags, and so forth. Never mind the hundreds of questions before the buy closes, dealing with the brewery/maltster/etc. On split day it's often a whole day affair with the volunteers taking time off their work (unpaid/using their vacation time). A lot of the work is ahead of time, even building the website or spreadsheet to capture orders too. There is a lot of money at stake, especially if some who place orders never show up. There are always stragglers too so the grain often needs to get moved/muled by volunteers again.

These volunteers do this for the love of the hobby, to help other brewers. Complaining about driving distances after someone put all this time and effort in to help is not going to be well received so I'd keep it yourself.

Group buys are not for you. You need to reset your expectations. You can't have your cake and eat it too.

Kal

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dp Brewing Company



Joined: 08 Jul 2013
Posts: 549
Location: Midwest

Drinking: Belgian Waffle Strong Ale, Dry Barn Door #13, Bham Brown, White Shadow Stout, Rye Not Today

Working on: Maple Mead Barrel Aged


PostLink    Posted: Mon May 21, 2018 12:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

KB wrote:
dp Brewing Company wrote:
Speaking of group buys, I got an email from Northern Brewer wanting to know if my local homebrew club would like to do a bulk buy. I was surprised to get the email.


I believe Northern Brewer is owned by InBev.


They are along with Midwest Supplies. Not sure why that matters though.

I had a good friend once told me he doesn't order from Northern Brewer now that they are owned by InBev. I asked him why. He said, "Because they are like the Walmart of brewing". I then asked him if he still shops at Walmart. He smiled and didn't say a word.

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