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Two brews on new system -- very low efficiency (~55%)

 
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kcramp858




Joined: 11 Dec 2017
Posts: 4



PostLink    Posted: Tue Apr 17, 2018 2:58 am    Post subject: Two brews on new system -- very low efficiency (~55%) Reply with quote


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So -- I built a larger Electric Brewery system, scaled up as a clone from Kal's system using three 55 gallon stainless pots (Diameter 60cm, Height 80cm, Thickness 5.0mm, 210L).

I mounted all of the hardware and elements low enough so that I can still brew a 5 gallon batch without frying the elements -- however, this is presenting various problems. I am not sure of where the problems may lie, so I want to posit some thoughts and maybe other can assist with helping me improve my efficiency.

    1. I have approximately 2 gallons of dead space under my false bottom, which is causing challenges with my water requirements. This is due to the fact that I made my false bottom from scratch -- the gauge of the stainless is very thick and there is a convexity to it, such that even without feet on it, it is raised in the center of the false bottom. With 2 gallons of dead space, mashing is very difficult. I will either leave a lot of water or have a very thin mash. Is this a problem, or can I just add an extra 2 gallons? Due to the wide diameter, it is difficult to maintain "2 inches of water" over the grain without using a ton of water.

    2. When I am sparging, it seems like no matter what I do, I cannot decrease the flow enough to make the sparging step take as long as listed in the 'Using Your Brewery' guide. The longest I have been able to draw it out is ~20 minutes to complete the sparging process. It seems that with my ball valves, I don't have fine enough control and if I try to go any slower than ~20 minutes, I lose suction and halt flow. If I open the valve a little more, I get too much flow. Not sure how to combat this problem -- add a more adjustable needle valve on the discharge?

    3. I believe a major contributor to this specific batch poor efficiency is that I had the mash tun recirc hose partially buried by grain, so I believe during the sparge, I was only sparging to the bottom 50% of the grain bed. Can anyone confirm? Should I lay the hose across the top? If there is no 2 inches of water, the hose appears to just promote channeling.


I am not really sure what to do, but I wanted to hopefully spark a discussion with those more knowledgeable than I in what I can do to improve efficiency.
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701pilot




Joined: 10 May 2016
Posts: 50
Location: northern california

Drinking: Bohemian Pilsner,Caribou Slobber, Munich Helles, Weissbier, Black Bute Porter, RIS, Irish Red Ale

Working on: Milk Chocolate Stout


PostLink    Posted: Tue Apr 17, 2018 4:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

You are really asking a lot of this system. The diameter of the mash compared to the height is way off for that small of a batch. I guess you could use a lot more water and just run a longer boil. That has its own problems depending on what type of beer you're trying to brew.

Move the elements to smaller kettles for the smaller batches. One size does not fit all.

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Mark

I can't change the laws of physics but with enough horse power I can chase it into submission.
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kcramp858




Joined: 11 Dec 2017
Posts: 4



PostLink    Posted: Tue Apr 17, 2018 5:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mark --

I believe I just rambled a bit when I was typing above. I have been making a minimum of 10 gallon batch sizes, and apparently forgot to mention it.

With 10 gallon batch sizes, I thought I would be pushing it but it would still be doable..

I am also debating the idea of a no sparge technique for these smaller 5/10 gallon batches. That could eliminate the problem with the dead space.
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kal
Forum Administrator



Joined: 12 Dec 2010
Posts: 11116
Location: Ottawa, Canada

Drinking: Pub Ale, Electric Creamsicle, Mild, Pliny the Younger, Belgian Dark Strong, Weizen, Russian Imperial Stout, Black Butte Porter


PostLink    Posted: Tue Apr 17, 2018 11:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

When you say efficiency I'm assuming you mean mash conversion efficiency and not something else.

I think you're right on all accounts. Things that will hurt your mash efficiency:

- 20 minute fly sparge. You should aim for 60-90 mins. I can't offer any suggestions to your loosing suction issue. Need more information.

- If the hose is truly buried half way down the grain bed that's not good. That coupled with the above is your most likely cause. Place the hose at the top of the grain bed. It might dig in a bit but as long as you sparge slowly you'll be ok.

- You may have channeling or side wall shunting due to your false bottom/kettle. Would need some pictures to better understand how they interact.

- Check your mill gap. See my grain mill article for more info. Milling too fine will only exasperate channeling/side wall shunting. You want to mill loose.

I would post lots of pictures too, of the equipment, of when you're brewing. We don't now what we don't know, so there may be things you're not realizing are important.

Good luck!

Kal

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