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First Brew Day Q's

 
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mike0416




Joined: 03 Jan 2017
Posts: 62



PostLink    Posted: Fri Feb 02, 2018 10:02 pm    Post subject: First Brew Day Q's Reply with quote


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Hi Kal.

First brew day went fairly smooth (and awesome!). I have just few questions:

1. My old setup used to get me a brewhouse efficiency of about 68 - 70%. This particular brew I was making would usually give me an OG of about 1.048. Today I got 1.061. That a difference of a 21% bh efficiency! I remember reading that you get b/t 90 - 95%, so I'm assuming this is correct, but I did have to look a few times Shocked. That being the case, other than the higher abv I'll get (never a bad thing imo), am I going to lose out on any flavor, or will it just be a higher alcohol content?

2. I had to raise my HLT during mashing a few degrees over my BK to get it to mash temp. I have the same setup as you do: same pumps, kettles, qd's, hoses, etc. During the mash I measured the temp of the mash coming out of the hose in the BK with my thermapen. It matched the temp of the HLT right on the number. Yet, sticking the same thermapen in the mash it was indeed a couple of degrees cooler. Why would this be? One thought: It's cold in my garage today - about 45 F.

3. Along the same lines, my boil temp never got about 211 F, and that was only for a few minutes. It usually stayed around 210 F. I set this to manual 100 the entire boil. Thoughts?

4. Chilling Step: Idk why, but the wort was having a bit of an issue getting through the hop stopper. This was a porter, and not a lot of hops were used (2 oz. total). I couldn't figure it out. I got it going my using the siphoning power of the pump, but I thought it would have flowed freely down to the outlet of the pump before I actually turned the pump on. Any idea why this would happen
Also, how much wort is left in your BK at the end of your day? I felt that the hopstopper impeded the process. Per your instructions, if I turned the pump down as low as you say one I saw the screen on the hopstopper, but I wasn't getting any wort into the pump at all.
Last question on this subject: Any tips and tricks when disconnecting the wort chiller. All of the wort in the chiller seemed to leak out and made a real mess. Could this have been because of all of the problems I was having with this step? Would there be no wort left in the chiller if this completed correctly?
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kal
Forum Administrator



Joined: 12 Dec 2010
Posts: 11116
Location: Ottawa, Canada

Drinking: Pub Ale, Electric Creamsicle, Mild, Pliny the Younger, Belgian Dark Strong, Weizen, Russian Imperial Stout, Black Butte Porter


PostLink    Posted: Fri Feb 02, 2018 10:30 pm    Post subject: Re: First Brew Day Q's Reply with quote

mike0416 wrote:
1. My old setup used to get me a brewhouse efficiency of about 68 - 70%. This particular brew I was making would usually give me an OG of about 1.048. Today I got 1.061. That a difference of a 21% bh efficiency! I remember reading that you get b/t 90 - 95%[

Don't confuse mash (sometimes called conversion) efficiency with brewhouse efficiency. They are not the same thing.

See:



I don't know what my brewhouse efficiency is (it's not something I care about as it has nothing to do with making consistent beer, it's about trying to minimize liquid losses, something I don't care about as long as I get a couple of 5 gallon kegs completely full at the gravity I was targeting).

If you got 1.061 instead of 1.048 then your mash efficiency is much higher. You'll need to use less grain now on your new setup. That's a good thing. Wink

Quote:
other than the higher abv I'll get (never a bad thing imo), am I going to lose out on any flavor, or will it just be a higher alcohol content?

Not sure. It will be higher in alcohol. Higher alcohol will taste different. How different depends on the beer, recipe, your perception, etc.

Quote:
2. I had to raise my HLT during mashing a few degrees over my BK to get it to mash temp. I have the same setup as you do: same pumps, kettles, qd's, hoses, etc. During the mash I measured the temp of the mash coming out of the hose in the BK with my thermapen. It matched the temp of the HLT right on the number. Yet, sticking the same thermapen in the mash it was indeed a couple of degrees cooler. Why would this be? One thought: It's cold in my garage today - about 45 F.

This is a common question - it comes up a lot if you poke around a bit and search:

http://www.theelectricbrewery.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=25474
http://www.theelectricbrewery.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=26408
http://www.theelectricbrewery.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=28283
http://www.theelectricbrewery.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=25474
http://www.theelectricbrewery.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=30387
http://www.theelectricbrewery.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=26722

Quick thoughts:

Make sure to calibrate both MLT and HLT temp probes in a cut of warm water at around mash temp (150-160F) first using a known accurate thermometer like the ThermaPen. See the Control Panel setup instructions.

Are you using the same thick walled hoses or the thinner walled ones? Thinner ones lose more heat.

Are you recirculating all pumps at 100%.

45F in the brewery will not help for sure. You'll lose more heat out of the MLT.

Quote:
3. Along the same lines, my boil temp never got about 211 F, and that was only for a few minutes. It usually stayed around 210 F. I set this to manual 100 the entire boil. Thoughts?

What's your elevation? Was the temp probe calibrated per the Control Panel setup instructions?

Quote:
4. Chilling Step: Idk why, but the wort was having a bit of an issue getting through the hop stopper. This was a porter, and not a lot of hops were used (2 oz. total). I couldn't figure it out. I got it going my using the siphoning power of the pump, but I thought it would have flowed freely down to the outlet of the pump before I actually turned the pump on. Any idea why this would happen

Something was causing the wort to not flow, but without more information to assess, I don't know why. Sorry.

Quote:
Also, how much wort is left in your BK at the end of your day?

Pretty much drains completely (as long as I slow the flow down once the Hop Stopper's exposed to air).

Quote:
I felt that the hopstopper impeded the process. Per your instructions, if I turned the pump down as low as you say one I saw the screen on the hopstopper, but I wasn't getting any wort into the pump at all.

Sounds like you're still having pump issues (the issues you mentioned a few days ago).

Quote:
Last question on this subject: Any tips and tricks when disconnecting the wort chiller. All of the wort in the chiller seemed to leak out and made a real mess.

Don't disconnect anything. Run hot water with cleaner through first, and then rinse with more hot water. When done place the output hose low and flow into a bowl or something like that and the whole system (hoses and CFC) will empty. There'll be nothing left in the lines when you disconnect, and when you do, all you'll get is a few drips of water.

Quote:
Could this have been because of all of the problems I was having with this step?

I don't know. I don't have enough info to assess.

Quote:
Would there be no wort left in the chiller if this completed correctly?

I don't know, as I don't disconnect until after I've flushed with water.

Cheers!

Kal

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mike0416




Joined: 03 Jan 2017
Posts: 62



PostLink    Posted: Sat Feb 03, 2018 1:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Don't confuse mash (sometimes called conversion) efficiency with brewhouse efficiency. They are not the same thing.


Thanks for the clarification!

Quote:
Make sure to calibrate both MLT and HLT temp probes in a cut of warm water at around mash temp (150-160F) first using a known accurate thermometer like the ThermaPen. See the Control Panel setup instructions. Are you using the same thick walled hoses or the thinner walled ones? Thinner ones lose more heat. Are you recirculating all pumps at 100%. 45F in the brewery will not help for sure. You'll lose more heat out of the MLT.


Not sure about the hoses. I bought them from morebeer.com. I'll measure the wall and see. As far as the other instructions, I did follow them. Seems to be accurate. I'll play around with it. All in all it wasn't a big deal. If this is the worst thing that happens on brew day 1 I'll take it. Mug

Quote:
What's your elevation? Was the temp probe calibrated per the Control Panel setup instructions?


I performed the manual setup, but not the auto tune. I'll try that next. I'm in Boston, so I don't think it's the elevation.

Quote:
Something was causing the wort to not flow, but without more information to assess, I don't know why. Sorry.


Yeah, I'll look at that. Not sure why either.

Quote:
Sounds like you're still having pump issues (the issues you mentioned a few days ago)


Pumps are now working great! Just needed to come up the learning curve on how these pumps work and how to prime properly if just opening the valves doesn't prime it properly. Yesterday I had no issues. BTW, if anyone is having pump issues in the future you may want to point them to this video. It explained a lot to me -- https://youtu.be/IdwfzxblL_U .

Thanks for help!

Mike
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kal
Forum Administrator



Joined: 12 Dec 2010
Posts: 11116
Location: Ottawa, Canada

Drinking: Pub Ale, Electric Creamsicle, Mild, Pliny the Younger, Belgian Dark Strong, Weizen, Russian Imperial Stout, Black Butte Porter


PostLink    Posted: Sat Feb 03, 2018 2:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mike0416 wrote:
Not sure about the hoses. I bought them from morebeer.com.

They don't sell the thicker walled stuff. See: http://www.theelectricbrewery.com/High-temperature-food-grade-silicone-tubing-1-2-ID-3-4-7-8-OD

Quote:
I performed the manual setup, but not the auto tune. I'll try that next. I'm in Boston, so I don't think it's the elevation.
[/quote]
Autotune doesn't affect the temperature in the boiling kettle as you were running in manual mode right?

Quote:
Pumps are now working great! Just needed to come up the learning curve on how these pumps work and how to prime properly if just opening the valves doesn't prime it properly.

Cool! Glad to hear! Yup - takes a few passes through the setup to get used to things.

The magnetic drive pumps that brewers used are a bit of a double edged sword: I get lots of questions asking "Are there any pumps I can use instead that are self priming?" and the answer is alway a catch-22: Yes, there are, but you don't want to use them for brewing because you won't be able to throttle the output the way we can with these units. To quote my pump article:

Quote:
The pump's magnetic drive acts as a clutch allowing us to put backpressure on the pump to control liquid flow. We do this by placing a ball valve on the output (never the input!) of the pump. This is one major advantage of a magnetic drive pump: They are perfectly safe to run with the output completely blocked, completely stopping the flow of liquid. You won't harm the pump motor.

One disadvantage of magnetic drive pumps however is that they are not self-priming (they cannot clear air in the input lines by themselves). This means that these pumps must be placed lower than the liquid source so that gravity feeds the pump. The liquid sources in our setup are the three kettle outputs on top of our brew stand. Our pumps sit on the lower shelf so gravity feeding is easy.

These stainless pump heads also have a larger 3/4" center positioned inlet (as compared to the usual 1/2" bottom-positioned inlet) which makes priming even easier still. We have never had any issues with priming our pumps. We simply open up the ball valves and liquid flows straight into the pump head. The pump is then turned on and liquid is pushed up and out. A common complaint from brewers with standard 1/2" inlet pumps is that they require extra work to prime through specially installed bleeder valves and/or by playing with the hoses.


Link: http://www.theelectricbrewery.com/pumps

Cheers Mike! Happy brewing!

Kal

_________________
Our new shop with over 150 new products: shop.TheElectricBrewery.com
We ship worldwide and support our products and customers for life.
Purchasing through our affiliate links helps support our site at no extra cost to you. We thank you!
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mike0416




Joined: 03 Jan 2017
Posts: 62



PostLink    Posted: Mon Feb 05, 2018 6:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Cheers Kal!
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