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Wet Milling

 
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mnoltimier



Joined: 10 Oct 2011
Posts: 60
Location: Berthoud, CO

Drinking: Big Nut Brown Ale, Sky Pond Pale Ale, Smashin' Punkin, Berlinner Weisse, Vienna Lager, Hopulence IIPA, Helles Angels

Working on: Maude Flanders Red, Gallagher's Watermelon Wheat


PostLink    Posted: Thu Aug 21, 2014 6:38 pm    Post subject: Wet Milling Reply with quote


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I have my 3 roller monster mill set fairly tight and have dialed in my efficiency to about 85% depending on gravity. I have had some concern about my grist and shredding up the husks. Per JZ and Palmer, a perfect grist should look like you have fully intact husks but when you open them up they are powder inside. It made me look at my milling procedure because I was shredding the husks pretty badly. I never had any sparging/lautering issues but my lhbs was picking up some astringency issues. They suggested I "wet mill". I had heard of this term but never really put any actual thoughts about it. I decided to give it a try. I had a 20 lb grain bill and tossed in about 2 cups of water into the grain before milling. I stirred it up as much as I could. The grain felt moist... but not wet. The results were nothing short of AMAZING! At first I thought I wasn't milling at all because the grain looked fully intact. With a closer look, it was almost perfect. Nearly all the husks were fully intact and all the grain was pulverized inside. I was worried about efficiency changes but I still came in at exactly 85%. I'll put some side by side comparison pictures up on my next brew day. Awesome find.
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kal
Forum Administrator


Joined: 12 Dec 2010
Posts: 10288
Location: Ottawa, Canada

Drinking: German Lager, Electric Hop Candy Jr, London Pride, Weizen, Citra DIPA, Dubbel, Russian Imperial Stout, Black Butte Porter

Working on: Kolsch


PostLink    Posted: Fri Aug 22, 2014 1:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wet milling (also called grain conditioning) is required by some to achieve reasonable efficiencies. With a good mill and a loose crush per my instructions, you shouldn't have to condition, but if it works for you go for it.

More info at the bottom of the page here: http://www.theelectricbrewery.com/grain-mill?page=3

Kal

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mnoltimier



Joined: 10 Oct 2011
Posts: 60
Location: Berthoud, CO

Drinking: Big Nut Brown Ale, Sky Pond Pale Ale, Smashin' Punkin, Berlinner Weisse, Vienna Lager, Hopulence IIPA, Helles Angels

Working on: Maude Flanders Red, Gallagher's Watermelon Wheat


PostLink    Posted: Fri Aug 22, 2014 4:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have my mill set at .034" which isn't too small... try wetting the grain next time to see the difference. I was pretty surprised. It also kept the grain dust to a minimum as well.
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kal
Forum Administrator


Joined: 12 Dec 2010
Posts: 10288
Location: Ottawa, Canada

Drinking: German Lager, Electric Hop Candy Jr, London Pride, Weizen, Citra DIPA, Dubbel, Russian Imperial Stout, Black Butte Porter

Working on: Kolsch


PostLink    Posted: Fri Aug 22, 2014 4:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

IMHO .034" is too small for a recirculating system.

Kal

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rcrabb22



Joined: 23 Dec 2010
Posts: 461
Location: Illinois


PostLink    Posted: Sat Aug 23, 2014 2:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have tried conditioning my grain and for a 10 gal grain bill (~24lb) I used a spray bottle and maybe 5 oz of water, no where near 2 cups. Of note is to wait about 30 minutes after wetting and mixing before milling to allow the moisture to soften the grain husks. Here is an excellent link on the process I followed:

http://braukaiser.com/wiki/index.php?title=Malt_Conditioning
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stickyfinger



Joined: 04 May 2014
Posts: 172
Location: hudson valley, NY


PostLink    Posted: Tue May 12, 2015 12:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I just tried using 2 oz by weight of your total grist in water with a squirt bottle a few weeks ago with a 0.030" mill gap, and it was the best flow I've had and pretty good efficiency. I'm going to try 0.025" next to see if I can get my conversion efficiency up to 95% or so with good recirculation.
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HbgBill



Joined: 23 May 2015
Posts: 9
Location: N. Calif


PostLink    Posted: Tue May 26, 2015 8:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

rcrabb22 wrote:
I have tried conditioning my grain and for a 10 gal grain bill (~24lb) I used a spray bottle and maybe 5 oz of water, no where near 2 cups. Of note is to wait about 30 minutes after wetting and mixing before milling to allow the moisture to soften the grain husks. Here is an excellent link on the process I followed:

http://braukaiser.com/wiki/index.php?title=Malt_Conditioning


Wow, I checked that page out.. 0.55mm? that is less than half of what I have my gap set on my MM-3. I have 1.2mm gap and am quite happy with it. I have, however, not tried a conditioned crush. I didn't get the stainless rollers.. so, I don't know if I'd pick up issues with rusting, etc. I suppose I could spray the rollers after use with WD-40 or similar.. even use EVOO to prevent rust. The EVOO would be absorbed into the first half cup of grain crushed, I'd guess.

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stickyfinger



Joined: 04 May 2014
Posts: 172
Location: hudson valley, NY


PostLink    Posted: Tue May 26, 2015 8:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

HbgBill wrote:
rcrabb22 wrote:
I have tried conditioning my grain and for a 10 gal grain bill (~24lb) I used a spray bottle and maybe 5 oz of water, no where near 2 cups. Of note is to wait about 30 minutes after wetting and mixing before milling to allow the moisture to soften the grain husks. Here is an excellent link on the process I followed:

http://braukaiser.com/wiki/index.php?title=Malt_Conditioning


Wow, I checked that page out.. 0.55mm? that is less than half of what I have my gap set on my MM-3. I have 1.2mm gap and am quite happy with it. I have, however, not tried a conditioned crush. I didn't get the stainless rollers.. so, I don't know if I'd pick up issues with rusting, etc. I suppose I could spray the rollers after use with WD-40 or similar.. even use EVOO to prevent rust. The EVOO would be absorbed into the first half cup of grain crushed, I'd guess.


Wet milling/malt conditioning is a completely different beast from dry milling. You can crush way finer with no problems. I did 30 mil or 0.762mm on my last beer and got much better flow through my grainbed (recirculated the entire mash) than when I dry milled at 39mil or 0.99mm. I plan to try 25 mil on my next brew to see if I can boost my conversion efficiency a bit more and still have excellent lautering. Lots of people haven't had rust issues. They don't really get wet at all. I just dry mine for a minute with a heat gun as a precaution. Do NOT use WD-40 or EVOO on the rollers! what a mess!
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HbgBill



Joined: 23 May 2015
Posts: 9
Location: N. Calif


PostLink    Posted: Tue May 26, 2015 9:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks.. WD-40 dries completely.. I can see EVOO as bad Smile I'd plan on using WD-40 immediately after blowing flour out of the mill immediately after use..
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James Edmonton



Joined: 29 Jan 2014
Posts: 124
Location: Edmonton, AB

Drinking: West Coast Dry Hopped IPA

Working on: Session Ale


PostLink    Posted: Thu May 28, 2015 4:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I wouldn't use WD-40 on anything that will contact food. If you are worried about rust, you could use olive or peanut oil (or some other vegetable oil). WD in not considered food-grade or food safe.
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huaco



Joined: 05 Apr 2012
Posts: 1508
Location: Burleson Texas


PostLink    Posted: Thu May 28, 2015 1:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It doesn't take much oil in your beer to start causing problems with head retention... you may want to rethink oiling your mill so much. and for all that is sacred and right with beer... DON"T USE WD-40! I love the smell of the stuff just like any other self-respecting redneck... but NOT IN MY BEER! lol

You may want to try to store your mill in a container with a descant pouch or maybe a bucket of damp-rid.
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