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berzai@sbcglobal.net
Joined: 29 Mar 2011 Posts: 74 Location: Indiana
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Link Posted: Thu Mar 31, 2011 12:02 am Post subject: |
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I will run a 4 wire, easy enough. To put you at ease, the system will be run by a professional electrician. I needed to get an idea of the hardware used for this application, as he is as well versed in home brewing.
As for the switches, I will purchase the ones Kal suggests. I may have a few questions as I go along, but for now thanks getting the ball rolling. If I get time, I'll take some pics of the progress.
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rosenjm
Joined: 21 Dec 2010 Posts: 249 Location: Ballston Spa, NY
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Link Posted: Thu Mar 31, 2011 12:24 am Post subject: |
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I don't mean to sound like an ass, I'd just hate for someone to get hurt. I've been working with high voltage electrical components for 20 years and I've seen highly trained technicians loose fingers, sustain 3rd degree burns and die working on controllers that are very similar to the one Kal has designed.
I think that having a professional install your 240V receptical is a very good idea, not to mention it is required in most states. If you have questions, please ask. There is a lot of experience on this site. Just ask first and turn it on second.
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Grandequeso
Joined: 17 Mar 2011 Posts: 36 Location: Jacksonville, Fl
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Link Posted: Thu Mar 31, 2011 1:06 am Post subject: |
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I know you are going for a bare bones build, but I would definately suggest that you throw in a low amperage in-line fuse to feed your controls (the PID and contactor) You could get a small fuse holder at a auto parts store or radio shack. I threw a one amp fuse in mine as my control panel doesnt control my pumps, I think that is what Auber suggests to use. It might cost an extra $10 to add the fuse, but that a lot better than smoking your equimptment. If you go with a 240volt set up you could just throw two fuses one on each line coming in. Also I don't suggest buying your PID from anyone but Auber you'll see cheaper ones on ebay, but most of them are serious junk, and good luck trying to mail one back to china for a refund.
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berzai@sbcglobal.net
Joined: 29 Mar 2011 Posts: 74 Location: Indiana
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Link Posted: Thu Mar 31, 2011 4:32 pm Post subject: |
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So a quick rundown.
I'm running a 4 wire line connected to the GFCI 50 amp breaker in my main circuit breaker box. This will run to a standard 4 wire outlet.
I am purchasing a 4 prong plug for the project box. The project box will plug into the aforementioned outlet. From there the 4 wires will run into the project box, which will be run through a water resistant compression opening, similar to the aluminum one used for the element housing.
I will follow the schematic suggested in this thread. At the bottom of the project box will be the outlet for the element. From the front you will see the PID, 2 switches, one for the PID, and one for the contacter. I would also like to include a light the turns on when the switch that engages the PID is on.
I was just hoping not to go too cheap, but to keep it simple. Right now, I just want to run the HLT element, in the future it would be an option to add another element outlet with a toggle between the two, but for right now, this is the plan.
Need to order the project box, PID, SSR and heat sink, probe, contacter, switches per Kal's website, and a light. I'm stopping by Lowe's today to get some 14 and 10 wire, terminals, and a few other odds and ends.
Really the question is wiring in the light and where to buy/install the fuses. I will have more as the stuff starts coming in, but for now, that is the plan...
Comments?
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bbognerks
Joined: 10 Jan 2011 Posts: 51 Location: Wichita, KS
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Link Posted: Fri Apr 01, 2011 1:16 pm Post subject: |
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If you are getting the switch and light from kal's links, you might as well get the contactor as well. It's about $5 cheaper from them than auber.
I wish I knew how to code links for Kal's credit.
Contactor
Pilot Lights
Switches
(Links edited by Kal...)
Make sure you msg them for combined shipping
Pioneer Breaker on Ebay wrote: | Purchase multiple items individually then send us message through the eBay messaging system asking and we will combine all items and consolidate the shipping costs. Not all items can be combined, some are too large or too fragile.
***Multiple item shipments are often miscalculated by eBay, if the combined shipping rate looks too high it probably is. Let us know we can adjust them manually before you pay. |
When you decide to add another element output, it would probably be cheaper/safer to add another contactor and use a low amp 3 position switch instead of a hi-amp toggle. You then switch the contactor coil with the 3 pos switch like Kal does. This will activate the other contactor and drive the other element. You can use the same SSR for both by just piggy backing the HOT2 to the other contactor HOT2. I can draw it up if you need help.
For wiring the light, make sure you buy a 240v pilot light from the link above. Then you simply connect it to the output side of the contactor, just like you are connecting the element. The really nice thing about the contactors is that they have blade connectors with I believe 4 on each output. Makes this a lot easier than with relays which have a single screw/ring spade terminal.
For the fuse, just get an inline fuse from radio shack. It only needs to be like 5 amps.
Fuse Holder
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berzai@sbcglobal.net
Joined: 29 Mar 2011 Posts: 74 Location: Indiana
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Link Posted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 9:02 pm Post subject: |
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Suggestions for the thermocouple? I was under the impression it came with a lock nut, washer and o-ring. Did you use the same technique to make a water tight seal as the heating element? If not, which way did you go?
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rosenjm
Joined: 21 Dec 2010 Posts: 249 Location: Ballston Spa, NY
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Link Posted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 10:26 pm Post subject: |
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berzai@sbcglobal.net wrote: | Suggestions for the thermocouple? I was under the impression it came with a lock nut, washer and o-ring. Did you use the same technique to make a water tight seal as the heating element? If not, which way did you go? |
Use the one Kal uses for his boil kettle. That way it will work with the PID. I comes with everything you need to install it on the BK. It is the same weldless method used to seal all the kettle penetrations.
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berzai@sbcglobal.net
Joined: 29 Mar 2011 Posts: 74 Location: Indiana
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Link Posted: Thu Apr 07, 2011 6:03 pm Post subject: Schematic |
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Here is the path I was thinking on going. The pilot light I'm not sure about. As for the wire gauge, I plan on using all 10, but where can I use 14. Also, where the black line splits to the PID and the contactor/ssr, could I splice these or should I use some sort of terminal bar. At some point in the future, I would like to add another element, but for now this is where I stand.
Mounting the ssr and contractor, which way did you go?
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pola0502ds
Joined: 14 Mar 2011 Posts: 290 Location: poland, Ohio
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Link Posted: Thu Apr 07, 2011 6:14 pm Post subject: |
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the thermocouple pictured, is that what you plan to use?
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berzai@sbcglobal.net
Joined: 29 Mar 2011 Posts: 74 Location: Indiana
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bbognerks
Joined: 10 Jan 2011 Posts: 51 Location: Wichita, KS
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Link Posted: Thu Apr 07, 2011 8:03 pm Post subject: |
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If you are using a 240v Pilot Light, then you need to wire it in parallel with the element.
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240v Pilot Wiring
Hot 1 from contactor----------|-----------|
PL EL
Hot 2 from contactor----------|-----------|
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PL = Pilot Light
EL = Element
What you have pictured is a 120v circuit and will tell you if the contactor circuit is active, but the light will be constant on. If wired in parallel with the element itself, the light will turn on and off as the SSR is controlling the output.
The SSR will be clearly marked. One side is the load side and will say like 24-480V. The other side is the signal side and will say like 8-32v or something like that and it will have + and -.
The contactor orientation really doesn't matter.
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berzai@sbcglobal.net
Joined: 29 Mar 2011 Posts: 74 Location: Indiana
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Link Posted: Thu Apr 14, 2011 2:20 am Post subject: |
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Where does the in line fuse fit into the picture?
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